Project Cerberus

Discussion in 'Viper Truck Builds - Project Logs/Recent Mods' started by Modern Barbarian, Nov 16, 2021.

  1. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Hello VTCOA. I am creating this build thread to chronicle the build of my 06 SRT10 QC, named Cerberus. This will not be an overly fast build as I will be doing all the work myself and this is my daily. I have a backup in case I need it to be down for a week or two. The goal of this project is to see what highly motivated engineer with some time, money, and cool tools can do to make this truck faster and more fun.

    A little background on this build and what its goals are. My primary purpose for going with a quad cab over a regular cab is that I need this to be a truck. I tow a trailer, have a family with pets, outdoor activities like hunting, and so on. So it must be able to handle gravel roads, towing, hauling, etc. This vehicle will also make several long road trips a year and must maintain the basic creature comforts necessary for this purpose. After those two then the third priority for this project is performance criteria. This is a street truck, not a race truck. So it must still be able to handle as well as be fast. This will not be a drag racing build. I will drag race the truck, but it won't be the only thing I do. I will also track braking performance, and figure out a method to test handling performance.

    So to lay out the performance goals: 1. 1/4 Mile time of 10.xx (Currently 13.50)
    2. 1/2 Mile speed of 150+ (Currently 121)
    3. 60-0 time and distance TBD (Time is currently 3.3 Seconds, distance not measured)
    4. Handling test, I am thinking a timed slalom of some sort.

    As with any good project I will be taking requests. If there is something you want to know about my truck, build, experience, etc, I am always willing to answer questions and complete testing when time is available. I will keep the primary post updated with the current status of the performance testing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2021
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  2. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    First update, I started this project log a little late and some things are already done. I don't have my time slips next to me, but I will update each mod with Times before and after. Each test for each mod was performed at the same place on the same day both directly before the modification and directly after.

    So far I have cut a full second out of the trucks 1/4 mil time. It started at 14.55 and is currently at 13.50. Please note this testing is done on a no prep road surface that does have a slight downhill grade so the numbers may not correlate to exactly the same as at an actual track. These numbers are only for direct comparison against each other. Atlanta Dragway is within driving distance for me, so a legitmate 1/4 mile time will be coming soon with the dragy in the truck to verify its accuracy. Both to see if the slight slope effects the time (I have run it both uphill and downhill, with only a couple hundredths of a second difference, so I always run it downhill as it is much easier to set up that way).

    In order to get this change, I have done several mods to the truck. The first is a long running project of weight reduction. I have weighed these items on a bathroom scale, which isn't the most accurate, but my numbers came in nearly identical to the things that have been posted on here. The smaller things (under ten pounds) were weighed with my kitchen scale that is accurate to the tenth of an ounce.
    1. Spare tire: 82 lbs
    2. Spare tire tools: 9 lbs
    3. Front Bumper modification: 30 lbs
    4. Center console modification: 5 lbs
    5. Windshield washer system including fluid: 12 lbs
    6. Cutting off excess bolt lengths: 2 lbs so far, not complete
    7. Lightened each rear door: 7 lbs out of each door.
    8. Fold Flat rear seat storage system: 17 lbs
    9. Second battery box: 3 lbs
    10. Hood liners, light, hardware, etc: 4.5 lbs
    11. Rear seat area weight reduction, see post below for details: 19 lbs

    For a total reduction so far of: 197.5 lbs
    I have been unable to get the truck weighed so far, but these numbers will be added to the weight I record to get the starting weight.

    I will update the times differences for each of these mods once I get home, but the performance mods so far are:

    1. Drop in K&N filter (came with truck so was on it when it ran the 14.42 at 98.65 mph "stock")
    2. SCT tuner from Tori at unleashed tuning with 170 t stat and 6200 rpm shift points (Much of the weight reduction happened before this and got the truck down to a 14.27 at 100.97, then ran after the tune install and went 13.76 at 103.87)
    3. JTSVP underdrive pulley (on the day of install truck ran 13.79, then after install ran 13.59 at 104.94)
    4. Demon coils, JTSVP spider layout wires, and E3 spark plugs (on day of install truck ran 13.60 at 105.63 then after install truck ran 13.5 flat at 106.38. found a damaged plug wire and two plugs on other cylinders that were firing through the ceramic and not at the tip. I think much of this change was due to old plugs and wires that were on the truck when I bought it, and the increased high rpm performance of the demon coils)

    You will notice that the times continued to decrease slightly before each mod with no other performance mods compared to the final time of the previous mod. Some of this was other small weight reduction work that is on the list, some of this could be fuel levels (I try to always test at 1/4 of a tank, but thats just eyeballing the gauge, some of it will be me getting better with this particular truck, and the final piece of it is weather. Its cooling down around here and I think this truck likes it cooler.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2021
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  3. SRT10VENOMOUS

    SRT10VENOMOUS 1800HP Club. And climbing Supporting Member

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    Sounds like a fun build, dont think there is anything you can do thats not already been done and tested but will be fun to see what you get into and what results you get. As for not a drag truck if you get it into the 10s that's pretty much a drag truck in this beast
     
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  4. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    I think thats where the difference could possibly be with this build. Being able to get there without going full drag truck. But you are right, there is so much knowledge on this forum. I have learned quite a few tricks for these already.

    The first thing I want to try and do that could be unique is a full 3d rendering of the frame so I can do a stress analysis. I believe that there is a lot of weight that can come out of this pig once I know where the unstressed portions of the frame are, especially since these are built on a 2500 frame.
     
  5. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Here is the latest dragy performance report
     

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  6. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Had some crap weather today so decided to work on a logo for Project Cerberus. Tell me what you guys think.
     

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  7. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Did some more weight reduction work today, figured I would post some more weights. Some of this stuff is pretty small, maybe not worth your time, but I put in the work for some stuff I haven't seen done here yet.

    first, the amp. most people in a quest for weight reduction just remove it. But I like my stereo, and this project is about obtaining speed while keeping functionality. So I started looking for ways to keep the amp but make it weigh less. Most of the weight is the speaker itself. There is some weight we can ditch that is not needed that you don't see. The speaker grill, grill mounting hardware, and the carpet on it weigh 1 lbs 1.4 oz. If you want to get as aggressive as I did, you can cut 3 oz out of the steel mounts that hold it down also. I did the design analysis on them and can get that out with no affect to the strength and no predictable cracking issues. Not saying the calcs are 100% accurate, but I will run it till it fails and find out.

    If you don't have kids, there are three car seat mounting harnesses behind the rear seat that weigh 14 oz total. Almost a pound for free.

    There is a liner behind the rear seat that can go to. You can't see it with the seats in, and I didn't notice any change in cabin noise without it. It weights 4 lbs, 9.6 oz.

    The carpet under the rear seat weights 6 lbs 14.5 oz.

    Here is where things get more aggressive. I started a structural analysis of the seat frames and found some areas that have little if no stress in them under load. This means that that area of the seat frames are dead weight. Mostly the space between the mounting bolts, and the space between the seat rest and the ground. I was able to take a pound of metal out of the seat mount on the driver side and another pound on the passenger side. So another two pounds if your willing to do some cutting and painting.

    The last thing done today was cutting off excess bolt lengths. Anything that goes beyond full thread engagement is waste. The factory uses longer bolts than necessary because it speeds up the installation process in the assembly line. As I am not assembling a thousand of these, so I don't care if it takes a little longer to get the bolts aligned. If you use a paint marker, you can mark how much of the bolt sticks out of the threads, then back the bolt out, cut that much off, and use a grinder to taper the ends so they will screw back in easily. There are nine bolts that hold the rear seat in, and getting rid of the excess bolt length nets us 5 oz.

    Finally, there are three sections of rubber sound deadening material under the rear carpet. If you use a hair dryer and a scraper to remove them all you get 4 lbs and 3 oz out.

    in total, for about 6 hours of work you can get 20 lbs out of these trucks that has no effect on any of the features or comfort of the truck.
     
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  8. AMS3

    AMS3 Well-Known Member

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    One thing I don't see mentioned is an aftermarket TB. I installed a BBK and noticed an instant difference. Do you have one, or the JTSVP TB?
     
  9. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Not yet. Its next on the list. Gotta get through the holiday season before I spend money on myself though.
     
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  10. AMS3

    AMS3 Well-Known Member

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    I hear ya. When I first installed mine, it would stick at a little higher idle sometimes. I would have to tap the gas to get it to idle down. After a few months, the TB was worn in, and I no longer had that issue. Runs great! The sticking for BBK has been talked about on this forum a few times, but people had remedies to fix the issue. Cool part is, it doesn't require a tune, which I see you already have.
     
  11. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    I have read some pretty good things about the better throttle bodies, bbk or jtsvp. I will have one soon.
     
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  12. rottenronnie

    rottenronnie Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    What are you thinking about for power adders?
     
  13. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    I'm not sure yet. Already to much low end torque to put to the ground, so I am thinking either turbo or nitrous. Gotta do some reading on the safe limits for each on the stock internals.
     
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  14. rottenronnie

    rottenronnie Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    The Gen III O.E.M. Pistons are not the least bit tolerant to prolonged preignition and will fail in a spectacular fashion if the cylinder enters into detonation.

    Whichever path your choose, a good Tuner on a good dyno will be a big help.

    PS

    If you manage to reduced your QC weight by a cool thousand pounds (4600 lbs. with Driver= Actual Race Weight), you would need "only" 900 Flywheel to run a mid-10.

    Good luck with your project.

    Ronnie
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2021
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  15. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    Thank you for good wishes, I appreciate them. As well as the information you have shared. I now have some goals. I did some calculations after seeing what you posted, and you are right. There are some hefty goals here. I am going to update the first post to put those goals in, but knowing that this will have to be done in stages. I'm not going to hit all the final goals in the first stage of the build, that's for damn sure. So to be clear, my goal is a 10 second truck, but I consider a 10.99 to qualify for that. So I will update that goal to be more clear. I also need to set a specific and achievable weight goal. I am going to set that at a 5000 lbs race weight. I weigh 200, so truck weight is 4800 lbs for the goal. That is ambitious for sure. To get to the 10.99 ET region with that weight I will need 750 wheel horse power per the calculator that I used. That's also a pretty big goal. I am pretty sure that will require upgraded internals.

    So with these things in mind, I am going to break this project up into stages. Stage 1 will be a "budget" build, spending as little money as possible and only purchasing things that will work with the final goal of going turbo charged. This is where most of the weight reduction work will occur. I have already covered what I have done so far, but I have been working on a plan to reach the weight goal. I need to get this truck weighed to see how much I still need to go, so I won't post the plan for weight reduction until I have those details. I will, however, post the first 25 ideas I have as well as what I think the possible weight savings could be. This will give those of you that want to the opportunity to critique my expectations or offer advice.

    1. Driver door- 7 lbs

    2. Passenger door- 7 lbs

    3. All door window systems- 4 lbs

    4. Battery relocation- 0 lbs

    5. Rear passenger side seat- 2 lbs

    6. Driver seat weight reduction- 3 lbs

    7. Passenger seat weight reduction- 3 lbs

    8. Dash steel- 20 lbs

    9. Head light steel- 2 lbs (Actual loss after completion 2.15 lbs)

    10. Aluminum radiator support- 3 lbs

    11. Aluminum frame cross members- 15 lbs

    12. Suspension bolt excess- 1 lbs

    13. Overload springs- 10 lbs

    14. Spare tire hanger- 3 lbs

    15. Rolly thing in back of truck- 5 lbs

    16. Carbon fiber intake system- 1 lbs

    17. Frame weight reduction- 100 lbs

    18. Tubular control arms- 5 lbs

    19. Aluminum bed floor (136 lbs for aluminum vs 392 lbs for steel, these were calculated based on standard densities of the materials, and are grossly simplified estimates)- 256 lbs

    20. Rear bumper weight reduction- 20 lbs

    21. Bed frame weight reduction- 10 lbs

    22. Lighter wheels- 40 lbs

    23. Aluminum brackets wherever feasible- 15 lbs

    24. Smaller coolant overflow tank- 2 lbs

    25. Tonneau cover mounts, hinges, locks, etc- 2 lbs

    Total weight loss goal for this work

    536 lbs (Total possible after increases from actual weights taken 536.15 lbs)

    Then stage 2, we start in on the power. Preparing the short block for boost. So forged pistons, forged rods, better cam, etc. Then the long block with better heads and intake work. And finally a twin turbo kit with a goal of 15 PSI. That will probably go a little over the horse power goal, but I would rather meet the goal than fail.

    And then stage 3 will be to fix and upgrade all the shit a monster engine like that breaks.
     

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    Last edited: Dec 7, 2021 at 2:05 PM
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  16. Srt10650

    Srt10650 Full Access Member

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    Don’t forget the trans, at those power levels your 48re will also need upgrades. Unless you plan on 6 speed swapping it?
     
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  17. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    I'm still debating on the trans. This thing still has to be a truck, so it had to be able to tow. I know the 48re can be built for the power, but I'm still debating on an 8 speed auto swap from a newer model truck.
     
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  18. rottenronnie

    rottenronnie Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Is someone working on an interface for our JTEC controller (ecu) to communicate with the new 8-speed and an adapter for the trans itself?
     
  19. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    I have heard some rumors. Nothing confirmed yet. Most likely would have to use a standalone trans controller.
     
  20. Modern Barbarian

    Modern Barbarian Member

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    So todays progress on project Cerberus was more weight reduction. I picked one off the list that I could tackle in a couple hours, so i tackled the headlight buckets. There is a little over a pound of excess metal that can be removed from each headlight bucket. I used a body saw for the bulk removal and a carbide burr in a die grinder for final clean up. With all the material removed I was able to save 2 lbs and 2.4 ounces. So my 2 lbs estimate was pretty close. One more step down. 20211202_173548.jpg 20211202_173701.jpg
     
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