X-Pipe with Magnaflow?

00SVTStrike

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Any thoughts on an X-Pipe pre a Magnaflow Cat-Back? I ask because the Magnaflow is dual in dual out... supposed to have a sort of internal X.... but im wondering if I would benefit from one pre-muffler anyway.... and if nothing else... is there any harm in redundant X-Pipes in one system?
 
anytime you have crossover in exhaust, you have a "mix" of air trying to escape... obviously, you want exhaust to be able to escape as quickly as possible, but you still need backpressure...most of the time it's for pressure release, but to me two xpipes seems redundant...

although, i have a 3" stainless xpipe you can have for $50+ shipping if you want to try it out;)
 
good ? i think it might help because the x is before the muffler getting a better vac pulse and instead of expanding in the muffler then tryin to get the vac pulse
 
I guess more importantly... does anyone think it could HURT the power... wish i knew exactly what these mufflers looked like inside...
 
The way it was explained to me by my exhaust guy was that x pipes and h pipes need to be placed in a very certain area for best performance. He told me the process he uses to decide that for each system. ( has to do with how far back the "heat" travels in the pipes) I have the magnaflow dual in/out muffler and he still suggested using an x pipe. I don't have it on mine as of yet, but will try it out in the near future. Also, I don't have cats, so that may be a factor in his suggestion.
 
The way it was explained to me by my exhaust guy was that x pipes and h pipes need to be placed in a very certain area for best performance. He told me the process he uses to decide that for each system. ( has to do with how far back the "heat" travels in the pipes) I have the magnaflow dual in/out muffler and he still suggested using an x pipe. I don't have it on mine as of yet, but will try it out in the near future. Also, I don't have cats, so that may be a factor in his suggestion.

Thanks for the input... I as well do not have cats...
 
The way it was explained to me by my exhaust guy was that x pipes and h pipes need to be placed in a very certain area for best performance. He told me the process he uses to decide that for each system. ( has to do with how far back the "heat" travels in the pipes) I have the magnaflow dual in/out muffler and he still suggested using an x pipe. I don't have it on mine as of yet, but will try it out in the near future. Also, I don't have cats, so that may be a factor in his suggestion.

My shop painted a line down my mid pipes with cheap flat black paint. They told me to drive the hell out of it and come back. When i did there was a white spot on each pipe, and thats where he intalled the x pipe.
 
My shop painted a line down my mid pipes with cheap flat black paint. They told me to drive the hell out of it and come back. When i did there was a white spot on each pipe, and thats where he intalled the x pipe.

Yep.....exactly what my shop does.
 
Roughly how far down the exhaust was that area? Im guessing its back near the tranny tail where the pipes are next to one another?... (I just want to know roughly where to put my paint.. haha
 
I haven't seen him actually do it but he said he starts just after the cats (or where they would be) and goes about half way back on the exhaust.
 
soundings interesting...make sure you post your results...a before and after dyno or better yet track times would be wonderful if able to do....
 
soundings interesting...make sure you post your results...a before and after dyno or better yet track times would be wonderful if able to do....

The "after" explosion of unburned fuel in the exhaust. The backfire. Happens at that spot i guess. Also the hottest portion of the flame front being spit out by the engine is the very tip of it. By putting a cross over at that spot, it allow the fumes to evacuate down both pipes greatly reducing all the shit talk and popping. Top end power for x pipe, low end torque for H. The x pipe effectivly cross overs the exhaust throughout the rpm. The H pipe kinda dissappears as the rpm increases and subsequent pressure increases. The exhaust flow goes straight through its pipe and it really doesnt do much but equalize pressure.

Only thing is. This is much more effective on V-8's because they fire left, right, left right. The Viper fires both banks at the same time. Essentially a dual in line 5 cylinder. As a result you dont get the vacuum behind the pulse of exhaust gases to scavenge the exhaust from the opposite pipe.

Headers with the 2 into 3 setup for each side, helps pull some of the exhaust out the next cylinder from the same bank, but due to the nature of the dual firing 5's crossovers dont do a whole lot for power on these engines.

The Magnaflow Dual in Dual out muffler has a true x. Which means both inlets merge into one single 2.5 or 3 inch area, crosses over each other exits out opposite sides of the outlet. This would work great on a V-8 as you would only have one pipe at a time pressurized from that exhaust stroke.

However when you have both pipes trying to evacuate exhaust gases through the converged x pipe, in the magnaflow muffler, i think it causes congestion and un-needed backpressure. X pipe before the muffler would make no difference, just exacerbate the issue.
 
However when you have both pipes trying to evacuate exhaust gases through the converged x pipe, in the magnaflow muffler, i think it causes congestion and un-needed backpressure. X pipe before the muffler would make no difference, just exacerbate the issue.

So whats the answer? An X or H followed by two individual mufflers in place of the maggy? :dontknow:
 
So whats the answer? An X or H followed by two individual mufflers in place of the maggy? :dontknow:

I take a very humble, but common sense approach to this subject. Internal combustion engine is an internal combustion engine. I dont think there is a magical combination to these engines for exhaust or that it takes a tuning prodigy gift from god to dial the tune in. Sure they have their querks. But physics is physics. I put 8 completely different custom exhaust systems on my last truck within 3 weeks. Different mufflers, crossovers, you name it. Ultimately the only changes were sound and amount of popping.

The stock system from the cat back is not bad. Its quiet. But if you look in it, its a perforated core (not even louvered) straight through muffler with a straight through resonator. Its even somewhat mandrel bent. The manifolds are decently long tubed, and free flowing. Most will tell you there is little change going with short tubes, and just a tad more with long tubes. Most cant feel the difference, and the cost ultimately isnt justified unless you have the money to blow, or like the way it looks. Once you get the catalytic converters off (The rears specifically) There isnt going to be much a difference in power, and seat of the pants difference between the the stock system and a 2k dollar header 600 dollar mid a 1k cat back system. The only difference a cat back is going to make is sound if thats the only thing that changes. If anyone thinks im wrong, go suck a dick. Told you i was humble.

The second generation magnaflow, what can i say, at least it doesnt rust as bad as the first. But it has a 2.5 inch bottle neck between the mids and the system. Doesnt do much good to spend all that money on 3" mandrel bent stainless system with hfc mids and put a 2.5 inch connector on it. First fail. And as i eluded to earlier the muffler's internal crossover is not befitting the dynamic of our dual firing v-10. It seems they just used it because it fit. It just doesnt make sense to me. And subjectively, it sounds like shit. (no offense Geodriller) At least the exhaust tips are pretty.

Your not going to make any discernable difference in output, swapping the system you have, or modifying the crossover or muffler selection, if the muffler remains flow through and not chambered. These engines, naturally aspirated require backpressure for the low rpm torque needed to get their heavy asses off the line. After the cats are gone, mission accomplished. You got the restriction out of the way. You changed the power curve. Now pick the rest of the sytem that sounds good to you, and fuck everyone elses ears. Make them blead if thats what you want......
 
I've put sweet thunders on many previous rides and LOVED them... just not sure on this....

I want all the tone without too much raunchiness if I can help it... UNTIL I open it up...

Im not scared of loud really.. I mean I've had many true dual F-Bodys etc...

Im just not sure what mufflers I want to try...

Flowmaster One Chambers,
Sweet thunder,
Borla XR1s
Something else?...

I hate spending hundreds to find the sound I want....
 
Im just not sure what mufflers I want to try...

Flowmaster One Chambers,
Sweet thunder,
Borla XR1s
Something else?...

I hate spending hundreds to find the sound I want....

Ive done flowmaster delta 10 race, super 44 and the outlaw bullets. I also did the Borla xr1 race. All with both the X pipe and the H pipe. Completly different sounds. The borla's sounded the most exotic and aggressive. The delta 10s sounded like ass. Raspy and loud. Raw. The bullets i had to put a resonator in stock location on the same day, and thats what i kept. I used Twister Proflo, its like a spiral flow muffler, as resonators. The bullets took all the high frequencies out at high rpm, and the resonator deepen'd it, kept a smooth transition of volume and pitch throughout the rpm, reducing alot of pop and backfire. The x pipe was the icing on the cake. I had the most original, and distinguishable exhaust note at all three gtg i went to. Tons of compliments from fellow owners, and i always turned heads. They could hear me before they saw me, and someone was always looking around in parking lots when i drove by trying to find where the sound was coming from.
 
Extensive Dyno tuning was done at B&B to determine if an X or H pipe would be beneficial to sound and or power. It would change the tone but power would not be gained. They found that the ideal placement down stream would not allow for a shallow enough angle. The shallow angle minimizes flow restriction. Too sharp an angle and flow is hampered.

The image below shows how shallow an angle would be needed to show a gain in power over the traditional "dual" system. The RC trucks do not have enough room to place the X where it needs to be.

TheBBFacility013.jpg
 
When I put my Magnaflow on, I drove it for a day and when you shifted it, it sounded just like the Bullit Mustang. I couldn't feel any power difference. Went back the next day and had my Muffler guy cut the back 2 convertors out. A little difference in power, went back to days later and put in an Xpipe. It made a big difference in the seat of my pants feeling. No data to back it up, just the difference in driving.
 

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