sts turbo system

[SilvrSRT10]

Please forgive my ignorance. But from the engines point of view isn't boost from a turbo system the same as boost from a Paxton? I would think that the STS system could work as long as it has been tuned (ie. VEC2). I'll admit I don't know all the little intricacies that go along with forced induction. Does anyone know why the #3 cylinder has failed with the STS system (lean?) ? I think I've heard that when it fails, It's happens really quick. Others are running twin turbo's and not destroying the engine so what is it about the STS? Improper or no tuning? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[ViperTruck2933]

I'll start the bidding at $2.50

I'll go $3.00:rock:

 

[Silverback]

Please forgive my ignorance. But from the engines point of view isn't boost from a turbo system the same as boost from a Paxton? I would think that the STS system could work as long as it has been tuned (ie. VEC2). I'll admit I don't know all the little intricacies that go along with forced induction. Does anyone know why the #3 cylinder has failed with the STS system (lean?) ? I think I've heard that when it fails, It's happens really quick. Others are running twin turbo's and not destroying the engine so what is it about the STS? Improper or no tuning? Inquiring minds want to know.

I will give you my take on it this afternoon when I get home and have the time to do a proper response.

 

[UNIBOY]

Please forgive my ignorance. But from the engines point of view isn't boost from a turbo system the same as boost from a Paxton? I would think that the STS system could work as long as it has been tuned (ie. VEC2). I'll admit I don't know all the little intricacies that go along with forced induction. Does anyone know why the #3 cylinder has failed with the STS system (lean?) ? I think I've heard that when it fails, It's happens really quick. Others are running twin turbo's and not destroying the engine so what is it about the STS? Improper or no tuning? Inquiring minds want to know.

I think it was oil starvation. The guys with the TT's have had there motors built.

 

[Ram From Hell]

I will give you my take on it this afternoon when I get home and have the time to do a proper response.

I'll save you the time, John:

Turbo located too far from the engine...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't work like a "regular" turbo does...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't use heat energy... blah, blah, blah...

Isn't a good design...blah, blah, blah...

Tuning solution doesn't work...blah, blah, blah...

John just doesn't like it, in other words. Other than assembling the turbo and wastegates on my system, he does not have hands on experience with the system. No doubt, he's a smart guy, a good engineer, has experience working with turbocharged engines, and has paid attention to this whole mess. He's seen the resulting problems, and will expound on them all day. He has good reason not to like it, and will tell you all about it.

The rear mounted turbo system can and does work fine. It does take a couple minutes of driving before the system warms up enough to start creating boost, and is not as efficient as an underhood system. But just ask Sickness about how effing hard the STS twin on my Vette pulls. It's freaking nuts!

There are some issues specific to the SRT-10 that have to be addressed, particularly in the department of boost control and tuning (okay, so that's the entire system, but its FINE TUNING that makes the difference between breaking and engine, and getting it to work properly.) Smoke's truck took a little longer, but he took the time to get it straightened out before going nuts like I did. And as far as I know, it runs just fine now. No, it's not particularly cool that a customer has to deal with troubleshooting on someone's product, but that NEVER happens, right?

Of the six systems that I personally know about, only mine has bit the dust, and I say it's my fault. I treated it like the install on my Vette, and should have been more careful. If I had, I wouldn't have broken #3.

Just my $5000.02.

 

[FlyingLow]

Of the six systems that I personally know about, only mine has bit the dust, and I say it's my fault. I treated it like the install on my Vette, and should have been more careful. If I had, I wouldn't have broken #3.

Every system that I was able to talk with the owner had reasons why the blew. Over Boost being a big one. My install guys caught this right away and hooked up my waste-gates in a different manor. This ended up being a change that STS made for the QC's. I don't know if they changed it for the RC's. But I'm also running way rich which is helping me out. I think the STS system is a good system. But I do think they jumped the gun on release of it without doing more R&D. If I had to do it over again I would have not gotten the STS.

 

[FlyingLow]

Something else I did was talk daily with Rick Squire about my boosting issues. He was very eager to help me out. I tried several different things while troubleshooting my issues with Rick helping me out.

 

[Ram From Hell]

Every system that I was able to talk with the owner had reasons why the blew. Over Boost being a big one. My install guys caught this right away and hooked up my waste-gates in a different manor. This ended up being a change that STS made for the QC's. I don't know if they changed it for the RC's. But I'm also running way rich which is helping me out. I think the STS system is a good system. But I do think they jumped the gun on release of it without doing more R&D. If I had to do it over again I would have not gotten the STS.

Thanks for the response, Smoke. Of all of the people that can comment on this system, you're one of the best. I do believe STS could have done more in terms of testing before releasing the system. Delays in getting the tuning solution back from Roe Racing put them under even greater pressure (pardon the pun). I was one of the guys pushing really hard for them to get this sytem out the door, not that there was anyone else on this forum and elsewhere that was waiting anxiously for this system.

I would like to find out what all has changed with this system subsequent to all of the problems.

 

[Silverback]

I'll save you the time, John:

Turbo located too far from the engine...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't work like a "regular" turbo does...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't use heat energy... blah, blah, blah...

Isn't a good design...blah, blah, blah...

Tuning solution doesn't work...blah, blah, blah...

John just doesn't like it, in other words. Other than assembling the turbo and wastegates on my system, he does not have hands on experience with the system. No doubt, he's a smart guy, a good engineer, has experience working with turbocharged engines, and has paid attention to this whole mess. He's seen the resulting problems, and will expound on them all day. He has good reason not to like it, and will tell you all about it.

The rear mounted turbo system can and does work fine. It does take a couple minutes of driving before the system warms up enough to start creating boost, and is not as efficient as an underhood system. But just ask Sickness about how effing hard the STS twin on my Vette pulls. It's freaking nuts!

There are some issues specific to the SRT-10 that have to be addressed, particularly in the department of boost control and tuning (okay, so that's the entire system, but its FINE TUNING that makes the difference between breaking and engine, and getting it to work properly.) Smoke's truck took a little longer, but he took the time to get it straightened out before going nuts like I did. And as far as I know, it runs just fine now. No, it's not particularly cool that a customer has to deal with troubleshooting on someone's product, but that NEVER happens, right?

Of the six systems that I personally know about, only mine has bit the dust, and I say it's my fault. I treated it like the install on my Vette, and should have been more careful. If I had, I wouldn't have broken #3.

Just my $5000.02.

Well, guess I don't have anything to say in this case.

 

[SilvrSRT10]

Has anyone running another type of forced induction lost #3. If so, what makes #3 so vulnerable?

So basically, STS rushed the product out the door and decided to let the customers field test it on their $10K motors. Nice.

Does Paxton send their blower with a vec2 or like product with proper tuning?

 

[Blakewilder]

Yeah, its called a split second timing controller

 

[Ram From Hell]

So basically, STS rushed the product out the door and decided to let the customers field test it on their $10K motors. Nice.

They did do quite a bit of field testing on Phil's (Big Asp) truck, using it as a test vehicle. It suffered a piston failure, but they found an issue that they believed was responsible, and fixed it. However, this system did need more time to be studied for potential problems. There is something about this engine that just doesn't make this an easy task for turbocharging. Plenty of great success with supercharging though. Perhaps it lies in Paxton's 40 years of experience!

Must be why I'm going with it on my next project...

 

[Ram From Hell]

Well, guess I don't have anything to say in this case.

Hope I didn't stomp too hard on those big hairy feet of yours.

 

[RedSrt007]

Has anyone running another type of forced induction lost #3. If so, what makes #3 so vulnerable?

So basically, STS rushed the product out the door and decided to let the customers field test it on their $10K motors. Nice.

Does Paxton send their blower with a vec2 or like product with proper tuning?

I think that has been a little mystary for a while. Some say its a Oil Starvation issue, some say its a motor mount issue, some say its a tuning/detonation issue, some say its the VEC....I don't think anyone REALLY knows why they go out, but #3 is the common cylinder.

I do think it has something to do with the turbo / boost, but am not sure why the people go through #3's on the STS and not the Paxton. I have not heard of a #3 issue with the paxton yet. From all the information I have gathered, only 1 motor has blown with the Paxton (while thousands still remain on the road); and it sounds like it was more of a tuning issue. :dontknow:

-Red

 

[Silverback]

I'll save you the time, John:

Turbo located too far from the engine...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't work like a "regular" turbo does...blah, blah, blah...

Doesn't use heat energy... blah, blah, blah...

Isn't a good design...blah, blah, blah...

Tuning solution doesn't work...blah, blah, blah...

John just doesn't like it, in other words. Other than assembling the turbo and wastegates on my system, he does not have hands on experience with the system. No doubt, he's a smart guy, a good engineer, has experience working with turbocharged engines, and has paid attention to this whole mess. He's seen the resulting problems, and will expound on them all day. He has good reason not to like it, and will tell you all about it.

The rear mounted turbo system can and does work fine. It does take a couple minutes of driving before the system warms up enough to start creating boost, and is not as efficient as an underhood system. But just ask Sickness about how effing hard the STS twin on my Vette pulls. It's freaking nuts!

There are some issues specific to the SRT-10 that have to be addressed, particularly in the department of boost control and tuning (okay, so that's the entire system, but its FINE TUNING that makes the difference between breaking and engine, and getting it to work properly.) Smoke's truck took a little longer, but he took the time to get it straightened out before going nuts like I did. And as far as I know, it runs just fine now. No, it's not particularly cool that a customer has to deal with troubleshooting on someone's product, but that NEVER happens, right?

Of the six systems that I personally know about, only mine has bit the dust, and I say it's my fault. I treated it like the install on my Vette, and should have been more careful. If I had, I wouldn't have broken #3.

Just my $5000.02.

Actually Eric, what I do not like about the system is that it cost a lot of people a lot of money to rebuild/replace their engines. This system for whatever reason (I do have my theories) does not seem to be compatible with our engines. From a thermodynamic standpoint it's flawed in my opinion. It works with your Corvette and other F-Bodies. For that I'm thankful. I would have hated to see you loose two engines in two vehicles to this system.

So yes, I will continue to warn anyone with a Viper V10 to avoid this system at this time. I would feel extremely bad if someone was not warned and then lost an engine.

So think what you want about me and the STS. Your opinion is as valid as mine in this arena.

I'm just glad I thought about this a lot before I replied.

 

[Ram From Hell]

Actually Eric, what I do not like about the system is that it cost a lot of people a lot of money to rebuild/replace their engines.

So yes, I will continue to warn anyone with a Viper V10 to avoid this system at this time. I would feel extremely bad if someone was not warned and then lost an engine.

So think what you want about me and the STS. Your opinion is as valid as mine in this arena.

I'm just glad I thought about this a lot before I replied.

I hoped that your sense of humor would balance out your temper!

The "blah, blah, blah..." was intended to be a ribbing about your diatribe on the shortcomings of the STS system on the SRT-10. Indeed, I gave a nod to your prowess as an engineer and automotive guy in the know.

Being one of those guys out the money on an engine, I'm certainly among those who deserve to bitch loudly (or whatever) over this whole deal.

 

[Silverback]

I hoped that your sense of humor would balance out your temper!

The "blah, blah, blah..." was intended to be a ribbing about your diatribe on the shortcomings of the STS system on the SRT-10. Indeed, I gave a nod to your prowess as an engineer and automotive guy in the know.

Being one of those guys out the money on an engine, I'm certainly among those who deserve to bitch loudly (or whatever) over this whole deal.

"...diatribe...." Damn you. You know those big word cornfuse me. Now the "blah, blah, blah..." part I fully understood.

 

[TheSickness]

"...diatribe...." Damn you. You know those big word cornfuse me. Now the "blah, blah, blah..." part I fully understood.

and look he did not even have to draw you a picture

 

[BOOMER]

one thing thats is a HUGE concern that no one has mentioned:
WHY is STS CONTINUING to sell their system, when 99% of them have blown up? why would you continue to take peoples money, KNOWING the end-results to come? in Chucks case (the seller of the system in this thread) his was bought well after STS knew that their product was an ill-concieved idea at best. funny thing is, the STS system was supposed to be TUNED and SUPPLIED with the necessary CONTROLLER, and this fact was advertised by STS AND the TUNER who 'designs' and sells the controller. that in its self inspired many folks to buy this kit. its a case of a making a quick buck by both of those parties.
sure it can be made to work, so why not raise the price and include the componets to make it work? maybe because the price would then be realistic for a turbo system & then they wouldnt sell as many?
you can see where i am going, and its not a good thing that people continue to buy and then promptly blow up.
at the price Chuck is selling his for a person could reconfigure the system and add the required parts to make it work right, but it needs to thought thru, and utilize an AEM system and an upgraded fuel system.
#3 piston, usually detonates first, due to the intake design allows most of the airflow is directed at that cylinder, so their isnt a lack of air, and that cylinder since it can recieve so much air, it can detonate the earliest from leanout. also this cylinder runs hot being inboard of #1 & #5 cylinders, surrounding this cylinder with heat. the heat combined with an unequal amount of airflow, leads to detonation. thats why with a turbo, being load based, you need upgraded injectors, and a complete management system. the STS relied up "squirting" extra fuel by injectors located outside the manifold area, and it doenst allow for an even dispertion of fuel. this is a problem inherent with a single throttle body system the GEN3 engine have. thats another advantage the GEN2 manifolds have, is a more even distribution of the air flow.

 

[Blakewilder]

yeah....what he said