Stanimal
Full Access Member
no i am sayoing you are wrong, your truck did not run backwards, END OF STORY.
now i remember why i left this place.
now i remember why i left this place.
Upper ball joint caused my wreck.
- Thread starter JeffBoyette
- Start date
It probley backfired, blew all the hoses off of it, then that made it run like shit because it had major vacume leaks... if the motor was spinning backward (spinning not running) then a lot of gas would have built up in the intake, basicly the equilant of a Nx backfire...JeffBoyette said:
Stanimal is right the motor wont run, but if spun backwards it will push fuel into the intake. As soon a there is and ignition source, backfire...
Last edited:
Chill! Jeff wrecked his truck , bam! end of story
First off Jeff, suspension is my deal, have done a bazzillion ball joints, and if most here go out and check theres , most likley 75% of them will have cut , or weathered rubber around the ball joints, that does not mean they are bad
Second you almost never ever ever wear out an upper ball joint, trust me , there is no load whatsoever on the upper joint , there fore it could go a half a million miles and still be good.
Third , why a complete upper arm? is it bent? the ball joint itself can be replaced, if it was bent, it would most likely brake due to being aluminum.
Fourth if the ball joint is bad , how did he check it? and how much was the movement or play he came up with, they are allowed a certain amount of up and down movement
In 20 years or so of suspension work , I have replace one set of uppers, and it was on an old old pickup
As far as ya engine, shit like that happens, most likley the engine died without you knowing it(it is possible) but you were still in gear ,therefore the engine still was turning, building compression and blowing oil
Most likly your engine is fine, change the oil, check all hoses, change ya plugs, and go about your way sir:rock:
Not saying you are wrong Jeff, I can understand how you think these things happen, but also at the same time dont want to see a shop get into your wallet bo
you need a dismount and ballance of the affected tire, and a alignment, not a fourwheel , just a two wheel aligment is all thats needed.
How you wrecked ? only you know, the conditions , the timing, tires, rain, road, all comes into play.
Jsut thank goodness you are allright, but I doubt very seriously the upper ball joint is bad bo, have it checked by another shop, that doesnt know you were in a wreck, find an ol man that runs the shop ,
you may just get a different outcome
First off Jeff, suspension is my deal, have done a bazzillion ball joints, and if most here go out and check theres , most likley 75% of them will have cut , or weathered rubber around the ball joints, that does not mean they are bad
Second you almost never ever ever wear out an upper ball joint, trust me , there is no load whatsoever on the upper joint , there fore it could go a half a million miles and still be good.
Third , why a complete upper arm? is it bent? the ball joint itself can be replaced, if it was bent, it would most likely brake due to being aluminum.
Fourth if the ball joint is bad , how did he check it?
and how much was the movement or play he came up with, they are allowed a certain amount of up and down movement In 20 years or so of suspension work , I have replace one set of uppers, and it was on an old old pickup
As far as ya engine, shit like that happens, most likley the engine died without you knowing it(it is possible) but you were still in gear ,therefore the engine still was turning, building compression and blowing oil
Most likly your engine is fine, change the oil, check all hoses, change ya plugs, and go about your way sir:rock:
Not saying you are wrong Jeff, I can understand how you think these things happen, but also at the same time dont want to see a shop get into your wallet bo
you need a dismount and ballance of the affected tire, and a alignment, not a fourwheel , just a two wheel aligment is all thats needed.
How you wrecked ? only you know, the conditions , the timing, tires, rain, road, all comes into play.
Jsut thank goodness you are allright, but I doubt very seriously the upper ball joint is bad bo, have it checked by another shop, that doesnt know you were in a wreck, find an ol man that runs the shop
, you may just get a different outcome
JeffBoyette
Full Access Member
Stanimal said:
You cant run a modern four-stroke gasoline engine in the wrong direction, because the intake valve would be open during a piston upstroke, so no fuel could enter the cylinder. Normally the approximate order of things is: intake valve opens, piston downstroke, intake valve closes, piston upstroke, spark plug fires, piston downstroke, exhaust valve opens, piston upstroke, exhaust valve closes, intake valve opens (repeat).
If you tried to run that backwards, you'd get exhaust valve opens, piston downstroke, exhaust valve closes, piston upstroke, spark plug fires, piston downstroke, intake valve opens, piston upstroke, intake valve closes, exhaust valve opens (repeat).
To run backwards, regardless of spark timing, you'd have to replace the cam with one that opened the intake valves during a downstroke and the exhaust valves during an upstroke, otherwise air would flow in the exhaust and out the intake, and fuel would never get into the cylinders.
Thus, blowing the hoses off my intake manifold and fuel dripping out my filter.
Furthermore, an engine can rotate counter-clockwise if you grossly advance the ignition, or the moment on the rotational cycle when the spark plug fires. a typical ignition point on an engine would be, say, 20 degrees before TDC (Top Dead Center, or the maximum height the piston can reach inside the cylinder, with 0 degrees having the piston exactly at the top).
but if you grossly advance the ignition to fire WAY before TDC, you can make it run counter-clockwise..... but not very good - the fuel/exhaust ports, intake/exhause valves are all confgured for clockwise rotation, as is the oil splash system in the crankcase, oil pump, transmission, etc...... doing this is extremely hard on the entire system and introduces a tremendous amount of stress on the connecting rods, transmission and prevents adequate lubrication of the moving parts inside the crankcase - everything was built for clockwise rotation, even the pump.
Which easily explaines how oil could have been pumped into and out of my engine
BigRed460 said:
Stanimal said:
Both the brake booster and crankcase evac run from the vacuum the engine pulls. Thats how they operate. And having no hoses to maintain that vacuum causes the computer to attempt to compensate for the extra air and it cant control it.. And the ONLY reason for the IAC is to maintain idle under different engine loads (ac compressor) and air temp, not clean air. There is no way your truck ran FINE without an IAC. That is rediculous
There is no clamps on either end of a brake booster hose of an 05. Check yours.Stanimal said:
Stanimal said:
The engine did spin backwards as explained, and ironicly its assholes like you that make me want to leave it.
JeffBoyette
Full Access Member
I have the upper control arm in my hand, I can pull the ball almost completely out the socket and there is a half inch of lateral play. The ball rattles in the hole with and the metal around the bolt is bent and mauled. When jacking the truck up we watched the tire fall outwards with a clunk, and could shake the tire top to bottom and listen to the ball rattle. Cant post a pic but if you saw it you would laugh, its rediculous.
Mopar dealerships do not have a part number for the upper ball joint, and neither do any of the auto parts stores, as i am manager at Autozone. Quite a few cars and trucks have ball joints not replaceable seperately, requiring the purchase of the upper control arm assembly. Out of 100 or so ball joints we stock on our shelf, 20-25 come in big boxes with all of it included. 2 Dealerships have no part number for the joint, but the computer shows the assembly.
Oil is changed, plugs were checked and cleaned, All tires dismounted, bead cleaned, balanced, rotated and nitrogen filled to 38lbs. 4 Corner laser alignment. K&N cleaned and all suspension lubbed and boots were filled with green grease. Am i overlooking anything else?
Mopar dealerships do not have a part number for the upper ball joint, and neither do any of the auto parts stores, as i am manager at Autozone. Quite a few cars and trucks have ball joints not replaceable seperately, requiring the purchase of the upper control arm assembly. Out of 100 or so ball joints we stock on our shelf, 20-25 come in big boxes with all of it included. 2 Dealerships have no part number for the joint, but the computer shows the assembly.
Oil is changed, plugs were checked and cleaned, All tires dismounted, bead cleaned, balanced, rotated and nitrogen filled to 38lbs. 4 Corner laser alignment. K&N cleaned and all suspension lubbed and boots were filled with green grease. Am i overlooking anything else?
Stanimal
Full Access Member
well then, after your last post, you seem to know something, or maybe ya read it somewhere...
but in ANY case, even if it did backfire out the intake, it still did not run and THAT was my call on BS.
and EVEN not running, it will not pump 4 quarts of oil out. unless there is a much bigger issue I.E. bad gasket, rings or valve seals.
you are trying to blame your personal mistake on a ball joint, and trying to state facts that did not happen and that is fine. i did not come at you in a bad way, only messing around until you called me a ass. i might not know much in this world but i do know cars and trucks, more so ENGINES.
the main point is the engine will not run backwards, thus my BS Flag has been justified.
but in ANY case, even if it did backfire out the intake, it still did not run and THAT was my call on BS.
and EVEN not running, it will not pump 4 quarts of oil out. unless there is a much bigger issue I.E. bad gasket, rings or valve seals.
you are trying to blame your personal mistake on a ball joint, and trying to state facts that did not happen and that is fine. i did not come at you in a bad way, only messing around until you called me a ass. i might not know much in this world but i do know cars and trucks, more so ENGINES.
the main point is the engine will not run backwards, thus my BS Flag has been justified.
Stanimal
Full Access Member
need a part number for the ball joint???
my insurance agent has it listed in the eval. passenger upper is the one that broke. 39.99 advanced..... one snap ring holds it in the control arm, not trying to be a DICK just save ya a few $$$
my insurance agent has it listed in the eval. passenger upper is the one that broke. 39.99 advanced..... one snap ring holds it in the control arm, not trying to be a DICK just save ya a few $$$
Stanimal said:
maybe thats why the paint man wrecked your truck
it a ball joint consperency
just messing with ya dont take it to heart,, I know nothing and have a good buzz on some good old kentucky moonshine
Stanimal
Full Access Member
yup. we should blame moog the manufacturer..
not the alcohol he drank
not the alcohol he drank
sleeper
Full Access Member
If your engine blew out 4 quarts of oil you would have all over the engine compartment. Is there a oil mess?
Kevan
Full Access Member
Glad you and the 10 are ok!!! But when it happened was there oil on the ground or on the truck anywhere?? 4 quarts is alot to miss. Also the flooding would explain the smoke and rough idle, by the way what color was the smoke.
SlvrSnake
Full Access Member
That can't be pretty.:marchmellow:
Stanimal
Full Access Member
rly:Kevan
Full Access Member
There's another problem: TRACTION.
You would need at least top fuel-type traction at the wheels in order to get the engine to move in reverse.
The initial post said "empty tank" and "wet roads". The gas is almost a non-factor as it's positioned pretty close to center in the truck (not over the wheels or behind the axle).
The wet roads, however, are what blows the whole 'reverse rotation' theory.
No traction = no turning things the other way.
Even on dry roads, I would think that the tires would lose adhesion/skid before the drivetrain moved the engine in an opposite direction.
You would need at least top fuel-type traction at the wheels in order to get the engine to move in reverse.
The initial post said "empty tank" and "wet roads". The gas is almost a non-factor as it's positioned pretty close to center in the truck (not over the wheels or behind the axle).
The wet roads, however, are what blows the whole 'reverse rotation' theory.
No traction = no turning things the other way.
Even on dry roads, I would think that the tires would lose adhesion/skid before the drivetrain moved the engine in an opposite direction.
Stanimal
Full Access Member
Kevan said:
who knows... i saw a pig fly today....
but i think it was running from stinkers cousin :dontknow:
not to stick my 2 cents in but i will stick my 2 cents in any way lol,,,i use to have a 2000 dodge dakota r/t reg cab ,,,i was driving to fast around an "s" curve and did the same thing to my dakota ball joint ,,did not know it was broke tiill i took it in to get bald tires in rear replaced ,,,still dont know why my rear tires always go bald first mmm tire defect??? ,,i dont know ,,and hose popping off you had a major back fire or two,,, that oil missing now that is a strange one ,,if it died and was turning engine in the right direction you probably had blow by ,engine running back wards ,,the sound BANG would come to mind ,,,i wonder what ticket you got ,,,maybe to fast for conditions ???
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