Which Heat Exchanger????

[LitemUp]

Well I finally found some heat exchangers the will fit my truck with very minor modification. So the question is for all you tech guys out there. Which one would work best? I figure more surface area mean better cooling, but that comes with a drawbacks because that means less air to the radiator. I have a 172 degree t-stat and electric fan.

Here are the links with specs on both:
http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...=1002&osCsid=5dbcd54fa37c4b4f2694c5b6e7649c06
http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...=1026&osCsid=5dbcd54fa37c4b4f2694c5b6e7649c06

 

[1qksrt]

They both look awesome,
The full size looks to be my favorite,Let me check this a little further and I will let you know what I think!!!

 

[thjones3]

Will they give you the same cooling capacity? It really just depends on your cooling requirements and space you have to work with.

 

[thjones3]

Sorry, my last reply was vague because I was in a hurry . There are no technical specs on either cooler on the website. The cooler with the larger surface area will give you better cooling at the cost of internal pressure drop. The other cooler will have a greater pressure drop through the core for the outside air flow, which adversely affects the air going into your radiator. However the smaller cooler will not block the entire frontal area of the radiator. This will do two things: 1. "clean" air can get to your radiator and 2. The air flow will not be optimal for the charge air cooler (i.e. the air will try to go around your charge air cooler instead of through it unless you have a shoud of some type). With this cooler, your radiator can be more efficient.

Without getting into the calcs and not having performance #'s for the coolers here is what I would gather:

Large surface area cooler: Best choice if internal pressure drop is acceptable (should be able to find this out from manufacturer). With t-stat and electric fan, I don't think you will have a cooling problem. That will be dependent on the outside temps (it's hot in Miami) and the driving conditions (stop & go traffic).

Small SA cooler: I think the efficiency of this cooler will be much lower. Use this one if space constraints prevent you from using the other one.

 

[LitemUp]

Very good points mentioned. In addition to swapping out the heat exchanger I was going to also change the pump to a higher flow pump.

do you think this would flow the numbers that are required.

http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...=1001&osCsid=08b06bdfea3164d9ce5ba6346355065c

 

[Ram From Hell]

Sorry, my last reply was vague because I was in a hurry . There are no technical specs on either cooler on the website. The cooler with the larger surface area will give you better cooling at the cost of internal pressure drop. The other cooler will have a greater pressure drop through the core for the outside air flow, which adversely affects the air going into your radiator. However the smaller cooler will not block the entire frontal area of the radiator. This will do two things: 1. "clean" air can get to your radiator and 2. The air flow will not be optimal for the charge air cooler (i.e. the air will try to go around your charge air cooler instead of through it unless you have a shoud of some type). With this cooler, your radiator can be more efficient.

Without getting into the calcs and not having performance #'s for the coolers here is what I would gather:

Large surface area cooler: Best choice if internal pressure drop is acceptable (should be able to find this out from manufacturer). With t-stat and electric fan, I don't think you will have a cooling problem. That will be dependent on the outside temps (it's hot in Miami) and the driving conditions (stop & go traffic).

Small SA cooler: I think the efficiency of this cooler will be much lower. Use this one if space constraints prevent you from using the other one.

Uh, what are you talking about here? These appear to be liquid coolers for an air/water intercooler system, not intercoolers.

Also, I don't think there would be an issue using one that covers the entire radiator. The air flow through these ought to be unrestrictive, and shouldn't significantly effect engine temps. Honestly, I believe there isn't much point in going really big on a liquid cooler. Ambient temps limit how low you can get the coolant temperature (as with any heat exchanger, as mentioned). You really just need one large enough to prevent heat soak.

 

[Ram From Hell]

Very good points mentioned. In addition to swapping out the heat exchanger I was going to also change the pump to a higher flow pump.

do you think this would flow the numbers that are required.

http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...=1001&osCsid=08b06bdfea3164d9ce5ba6346355065c

This is the one I'm running:

http://store.summitracing.com/partd...Z-WP136S&N=700+400027+307495+115&autoview=sku

 

[thjones3]

Ram from Hell,
You are correct. Some of my comments above are more important for air/air intercoolers than air/water, but they still apply for sizing the pump/cooler to the application.

Litemup,
The website with the spec sheet for your pump is down, so I can't see your pump's specs. Most people probably just go with a manufacturer's recommended flow rate and make decisions from talking with those that have BTDT. There is nothing wrong with doing that as, like Ram from Hell said, most are just trying to get rid of SOME heat. I guess what I was getting at is that you can optimize your cooling system by pairing the right cooler with the right pump and external air flow. However, to do this you need to know a few things such as the entering flow rate/temp of the water into the cooler. The fin system of the cooler will also have a large impact on the effeciency of it.

Honestly, all of this doesn't mean much if we don't know the specifics of the cooler/system design. I would be happy to help you calculate/estimate the amount of heat rejection potential you have from your cooling system if you feel that it would be worthwhile to know. I can also compare the performance of the two coolers you have selected. I think most people probably don't care to dig into it that deep because either it is too much work or they just don't have an understanding of the thermodynamics involved.

Sorry for the long-winded response...

 

[Ram From Hell]

Ram from Hell,
You are correct. Some of my comments above are more important for air/air intercoolers than air/water, but they still apply for sizing the pump/cooler to the application.

Right. Just remember that you can size the coolant radiator to the moon, but it won't help if A) Your air/water intercooler is already extracting as much heat from the air charge as possible, and B) Your ambient temp is at a point that it can't get the water temp down any farther.

Also, don't forget about increasing the volume of the coolant reservoir. The total volume of the coolant determines the system's maximum thermal capacity (everything else being equal), which given adequate volume will prevent or eliminate heat soaking the intercooling system.

FYI, after a few good spanks of the loud pedal, my IAT's are about 100* or so. Then they'll drop back down to about 20* above ambient in a minute or so. More importantly though is that the intercooler liquid temps stay almost the same, so I know that I'm doing about all I can with the air/water intercooler I have.

Just to give you a point of reference, my coolant reservoir is about 1.5g (about 3x the stock Paxton tank), moving at around 20gph, and the coolant radiator is about 5x-6x the area of the stock Paxton unit.

 

[LitemUp]

Thanks for your input on this guys these are things I'll be considering when making my choices.

thjones3 - I will try to get the specs on those radiators.

Ram from Hell - Have you installed the FJO meth kit yet. I'm very interested in seeing where you mounted the nozzle and solenoid for the kit. I don't see anywhere other than right in front of the throttle body (looks tight). If I mount it right after the intercooler would it be as effective? (because of the curve into the TB). If you have some pics can you PM them to me?

 

[Ram From Hell]

Ram from Hell - Have you installed the FJO meth kit yet. I'm very interested in seeing where you mounted the nozzle and solenoid for the kit. I don't see anywhere other than right in front of the throttle body (looks tight). If I mount it right after the intercooler would it be as effective? (because of the curve into the TB). If you have some pics can you PM them to me?

Actually, I have TWO injectors set up for 2-stage operation. The first stage is installed in the DC Performance air intake elbow ahead of the supercharger, and the second was in the pipe you mentioned just ahead of the TB (discovered I needed that location to feed the IAC port), but will be relocated to the pipe before that one where the nitrous injector nozzles will be installed. I'm really not concerned about the efficacy of this second injector nozzle, since the spray is so fine from the FJO nozzles.

Here's a link to the complete writeup I did on the forum:

http://www.vtcoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20966

 

[LitemUp]

Actually, I have TWO injectors set up for 2-stage operation. The first stage is installed in the DC Performance air intake elbow ahead of the supercharger, and the second was in the pipe you mentioned just ahead of the TB (discovered I needed that location to feed the IAC port), but will be relocated to the pipe before that one where the nitrous injector nozzles will be installed. I'm really not concerned about the efficacy of this second injector nozzle, since the spray is so fine from the FJO nozzles.

Here's a link to the complete writeup I did on the forum:

http://www.vtcoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20966

Eric,

Thanks for the info. You have a wealth of knowledge and an asset to this forum.

What benefits do you think you would gain by placing the nozzle/solenoid in the intake charge pipe prior to the TB intake pipe if any?

This is actual the location that I'm thinking of placing the nozzle/solenoid. I would think if I were to mount the nozzle/solenoid in the location you currently have pictured (TB intake pipe) that I would not be getting the same amount of water/meth into both banks using the stock intake mainfold. Thus making my decission of moving the nozzle/solenoid further upline (closer to the SC) Is my theory sound?