Need some input. Round table discussion on the future of the Supercharger kits

[1qksrt]

I have always been a fan of superchargers,
Your product for the truck is a neat and efficient kit.Although I believe that an intercooler via front or rear mounted T.B. to increase plenum area or side mount unit as previously mentioned would substantially increase efficiency and lower the engine damage risk.Another idea would be to maybe go with a larger unit,this would allow lower boost level and not lose volume,also lowering intake temps.Just my two cents..

 

[Tekhaus]

Sean,

My 2 cents:

From a completely selfish point of view, I still want you to make top mounts. I was ready to buy on in February when I called you only to find the last one sold. I think they are a great little unit, with excellent support backing them up. Those who exceeded the original intent of your SC (searched for more power) or didn't get a proper tune, were (are) playing with fire.

I passed on a used unit on this forum because I do not like purchasing used equipment. I've found that I've ended up spending as much fixing all the little problems with used gear that I should have just bought new. So, to me the used market for your SCs is not attractive.

There are still some of us who in search of 500 or 600 ponies at the wheel, not 700 or 1000HP. IMHO, those folks should be going the turbo route anyway. It seems to me that if you go the turbo kit route you would be catering to a different crowd. But honestly, there seems to be much more interest on this forum for 700+ horsies anyway.

Also, it seems like the prices for power adders are converging. A one-off of your SC could run, what $8500? The ProCharger with intercooler is $9100. You estimate a twin turbo setup is $9000. I think a legitimate question is what would make your kit more attractive than the others?

Seems like a tough choice, but as mentioned above, it does sound as though you've made a decision and are just testing the waters. I guess I should start looking at other options. You've got my info should you continue on with SCs.

Best of luck, whichever way you end up going.

-Adam

 

[FerrariTruck]

Sean got agree with others, as much I would like to see improvements in the TS I will be honest that I would much rather have pick a turbo set up for a couple grand more.

IMO ths kit did exactly what you said from day one. an extra 100-125 hp and tons of torque.

 

[JMB Justin]

Well as a competitor and friend I figure Ill share my input:

Plain and simple I think the market for power adders for these trucks is saturated and the # of buyers is very small. There are currently three supercharger systems available (Roe, paxton, and JMB large procharger), and I should be finishing the development of a smaller procharger setup in the next few months, so then there will be four (3 of them centrifugals, and 3 designed for stock or mild motors). The affordable turbo market is not tapped yet, but its a very difficult task to make an "affordable" very small market turbo kit. The kit I sell is 15K+ installed and tuned and 1500+WHP capable, but theres not much you can take away from it to make it more affordable. Taking the tuning, dyno time, install time, cutting way back on the fuel system, and using a cheaper tuning slution like an SCT will knock a few thousand $$$ off, but limit the kit to sub 650whp power levels. Controlling very low boost levels on a turbo setup is also more difficult than a fixed pulley ratio on a blower. I think when its all said and done it would be at least 10K for a turbo kit that maybe 5 people would ever buy. The ROE top mount is what I have always recommended for someone looking to stay in the sub 700whp range because it was the best bang for the buck, used a real tuning setup and no fuel band aids. Either option will have its benefits and be the only one on the market, whether its a DIY TT kit or the top mount blower. Unfortunately with this current economy, the market for a 7K+ upgrade to a pick up truck is very very small.

Justin

 

[Furyous]

My 2 cents, I want a SC but can't afford the $7k+ they are going for, so here I sit waiting for the right price... I would prefure new but from the looks of it I will have to settle for used

 

[jtsdad13]

i will be looking at my FI build early 2010. i plan on forging the bottom end and upgrading trans in advance. having seen and heard in person the available FI options, i had decided to go with the tmts sc. you absolutely cannot beat the sound. i drive my truck as much or more than most. so your kit fits my needs best. nice power upgrade, but still driveable. from first hand experience your customer service and availability is second to none. i will be looking to add a reliable 625 to 650 rwhp. so i will support whatever decision is made. just know that there is a least one more guy out there with roe forced induction plans. and with the number of trucks for sale and the current low prices of our trucks, the aftermarket may actually be growing. as those soon to be joining the rbc, having just purchased trucks at rock bottom prices with mod money in hand. and i am sure many will be looking for the bang for the buck performance mods ie affordable fi kits whatever the option at their build time is be it tmts, single turbo, or tt.

 

[NYV10]

I do not think it is a good investment to go with the turbo kit for these trucks. That doesn’t mean I wouldn’t like to see you build it though. I think the more options that are available to the SRT10 owners the better. However, I believe that the 9-10k minimum cost is too high to realize sustainable returns. Like others have stated, with the current state of the economy coupled with the fact that this truck is no longer in production, it just doesn’t make business sense to do this. When I think of Roe Racing, I think of superchargers. You have made a very good name for yourself, as an honest company with a great product, superchargers. I recommend bringing the supercharger kit back. I also recommend that you try to keep the price as close as possible to the initial $6150. You said that there are a lot of machine shops needing work right now, find people who can do quality work at a price that will allow you to sustain the initial offering. I used to work as a purchasing agent for many years and trust me when I tell you at contract renewal, the renewals were always beneficial to the company by at least a certain %, or else I was out of a job. At the 6K range I envision myself buying your product, the higher the price the less probability. Not trying to be cheap just honest, and a customer.

 

[HOT RAM]

I agree with Justin that the market is pretty much saturated now.

With the almost certain probablity of engine failure with forced induction on a stock engine,I am playing it safe with very mild mods .

 

[Carlwalski]

KEEP THE ROE SUPERCHARGER

You have made a very good name for yourself, as an honest company with a great product, superchargers. I recommend bringing the supercharger kit back. I also recommend that you try to keep the price as close as possible to the initial $6150. You said that there are a lot of machine shops needing work right now, find people who can do quality work at a price that will allow you to sustain the initial offering.

Totally agree. The market has it's fix and there are others who will go the custom route if they want turbos so I think making a kit from scratch and reaping the rewards isn't going to happen, the market is just too thin. It's like selling XXL condoms in China. I think your Roe Supercharger kit is awesome, well known, reliable and a good bolt on fix for those street brawlers out there and at a very reasonable price. I would stick and work around that kit and if you can (I know you have been) trying to zero in on the costs and brushing the kit up a little, if at all possible.

As others have said, the turbo market is slim. I've never been a fan of turbos, I'll drive my Sisters Subaru if I want turbo. Superchargers are the way to go. In short, you fill a great void in the market with your kit, it basically goes: exhaust/headers, then bolt ons, then cam/pistons and head work then your kit and Paxtons, then turbos etc so you're in a nice position and a great one from a market stand point. Not everyone has $$$ to spend on making big hp. Your service is top notch, always happy to help and there after the deal has gone through, total professionalism! Best of luck with your decision.


Cheers,
Carl

 

[HV SRT]

I went with your sc because I think a blower should be mounted on top of the engine. It just looks and sounds cool. But I know if you want big hp numbers the trubo is the way to go. Like others have said the market is very limited so I'm not sure if either kit would produce very much profit. I love my Roe SC and hope to be at 750 rwhp soon. Thanks for wanting our opinions.

 

[LoveThisTruck]

My opinion...

Even if I had the money to do a huge engine build, and go turbo or twins... I wouldn't. Personally, I don't wanna spent $100k to have a truck that runs high 10's:dontknow: (I'm not trying to talk sh*t at all here)
These are 5000+ pound trucks... THEY WILL NEVER BE FAST! IMO, your ROE blower is the best thing for these trucks. Do a mild engine build, get all the bolt-on goodies, toss on the TMTS with a nice conservative tune, and have a blast:burnout: :rock: That blower makes these things so much fun to drive! 150-200HP and tons of low end torque... not to mention the looks and the sound. I'm more than happy with mine, and wouldn't have it any other way.

Brad

 

[SNAKEGUTS]

I myself was goin to go with the Roe top mount.

I think it sounds awsome and has a great power curve for street use.

If it was not for the fact that I was already pullin my engine I think I may have gone this route.

My twin turbo build is well underway.

I do hope that Sean continues to offer this top mount.

On top of that you cant beat the service!

Now, beside the top mount, I think Sean has what it takes to pull of a sweet single or twin turbo kit.

I would imagine a single as to keep price down.

It would be nice to see a single turbo kit that could work good and safe with the stock engine. Then have the abillity to turn up the boost for a higher HP build.

 

[NYV10]

My opinion...

Even if I had the money to do a huge engine build, and go turbo or twins... I wouldn't. Personally, I don't wanna spent $100k to have a truck that runs high 10's:dontknow: (I'm not trying to talk sh*t at all here)
These are 5000+ pound trucks... THEY WILL NEVER BE FAST! IMO, your ROE blower is the best thing for these trucks. Do a mild engine build, get all the bolt-on goodies, toss on the TMTS with a nice conservative tune, and have a blast:burnout: :rock: That blower makes these things so much fun to drive! 150-200HP and tons of low end torque... not to mention the looks and the sound. I'm more than happy with mine, and wouldn't have it any other way.

Brad

Agree with everything you said except that these trucks will never be fast. Fast is open to interpretation, but to me a 5000 + pound truck that can go 0-60 in under 6 seconds and a quarter mile time in the high 12’s with just a few mods is quick. Damn quick… I agree to get in 10’s with these trucks is not a practical thing to set out to do(Dollar Wise) but that doesn’t take away from the fact that this big heavy truck in her stock form will blow away 95% of other stock vehicles out there.

 

[LoveThisTruck]

Agree with everything you said except that these trucks will never be fast. Fast is open to interpretation, but to me a 5000 + pound truck that can go 0-60 in under 6 seconds and a quarter mile time in the high 12’s with just a few mods is quick. Damn quick… I agree to get in 10’s with these trucks is not a practical thing to set out to do(Dollar Wise) but that doesn’t take away from the fact that this big heavy truck in her stock form will blow away 95% of other stock vehicles out there.

You are 100% correct. For a 5k pound brick, these things haul ass:burnout: and that's why I love em.

 

[Roe Racing]

Hi Everyone,
Thanks for all the input.
I’m sorry if the tone of my post made it sound like I had already come to some sort of conclusion, but I hadn’t (and still haven’t yet). Based on some really good replies, I need to weigh the options some more. Thanks to George posting the original Sidewinder kit I made, I’ll have to throw that in the mix also.
Regarding the turbo, the idea was to possibly use what we’re doing on the Viper SRT-10 and just mirror it over to the trucks with some different piping. As some have suggested, maybe I can do both, continue one and start another, but in a way that the numbers and schedule work out for everybody. I’m far more limited on man hours these days, so I have to be realistic and not try to multitask too much. I’ve learned all about how that hurts my productivity.
Just about nothing I ever design is with any thought toward business viability. I always did it because I thought it would be cool or work really well if the end product comes out like I envision. Today, I have to actually think differently (due to the realization last year of having it cost more money to go to work each day than I actually earned in a day).
With all that in mind, I’m going to do a little more soul searching and a little more numbers crunching.
It would help if I had a truck of my own again. I HAD to sell the ’04 a couple years ago, even though I was nowhere near done playing with it. It may just be about time to get another.
Give me a little time to digest this and I’ll be back to you all soon.
Regards,
Sean

PS, thanks to those that made the comments about our customer service. That’s really nice to hear and I appreciate it!
PPS, the highest mileage to date on one of the TMTS kits still on a stock engine is Barry Grant’s QC. About five months ago, he already had over 50,000 blown miles on it. All FI engines won’t expire, but you do have to pay attention to basics, like air / fuel ratio and fuel quality when pushing parts to their mechanical limits. I think we can continue that trend and improve on it.

 

[Prof]

Sean...you can have my truck to experiment on every winter! Take it from Dec through April and maybe May...

Wow!!! Now that is an exciting prospect!

 

[Tooloe]

Sean...you can have my truck to experiment on every winter! Take it from Dec through April and maybe May...

Wow!!! Now that is an exciting prospect!

well hell if you need a trcuk you can have mine for as long as you need as long as it's free! :rock:

 

[Black1]

....
PPS, the highest mileage to date on one of the TMTS kits still on a stock engine is Barry Grant’s QC. About five months ago, he already had over 50,000 blown miles on it. All FI engines won’t expire, but you do have to pay attention to basics, like air / fuel ratio and fuel quality when pushing parts to their mechanical limits. I think we can continue that trend and improve on it.

It's too bad we ran Barry off the first day he posted on the forum.... I need one of his Demon carbs for my Vette.

 

[Prof]

It's too bad we ran Barry off the first day he posted on the forum.... I need one of his Demon carbs for my Vette.

You have a pm.

Roy

P.S. Tell him the guy that was so obnoxious has departed.

 

[Black1]

You have a pm.

Roy

P.S. Tell him the guy that was so obnoxious has departed.

Thank you, Sir.