Built Motor with Paxton Results

[Riff62]

Roy. I say get another SC from Sean and weld them together in an A configuration..Slap on 2 throttle bodies per SC, and Wah la..

Anyone know how many CFM a stock or otherwise throttle body flows?..
Anyone know if a Roe could be adapted for 2 TBs?
Anyone know if a Dwyer blower could be used ?..That would be cool..A 12-71 with 2 TBs on top..lol

 

[Prof]

I'm thinking about moving my forged engine to the Prius, then putting my Volvo 5 cylinder into the truck...just so I can have a turbo truck too!

 

[Riff62]

Better get 2 Volvo engines..10 cyl twin turbo..lol

 

[avmech]

I didnt think that the stroker would have that much effect on the boost. Really desent seem that much bigger in volume to go from a 505 to a 522, and hes running a blower spec cam? I'm sure you guys know more about it then me just seams like alot of boost drop. like I said had heads and blower cam and still made 12lbs.

 

[Dom426]

I didnt think that the stroker would have that much effect on the boost. Really

its not just the stroker but a combination of things stroker, heads, and camshaft

 

[avmech]

I'm not saying that I dont belive you guys just trying to figure out why so much boost drop even with a smaller pully lol. to make only 4lbs is really wild.

 

[LoveThisTruck]

I'm not saying that I dont belive you guys just trying to figure out why so much boost drop even with a smaller pully lol. to make only 4lbs is really wild.

You're not the only one who doesn't get this stuff:dontknow:

 

[QuickSilver]

I think there is another option for the Paxton but will take some R&D. For my build after the motor is forged I'm going to clutter up the engine bay with another Novi on the driver side. This may not be the best solution for the low boost problem but it will look pretty tits.

Dan does these at dcperformance......and this is in a tight Viper engine-bay!

Quick

 

[Riff62]

airflow..its all about the airflow...think of it this way..your regular garden hose is like 3/4" diameter right?..If you turn on the hose full blast, it comes out the end with a bit of force. If you change the hose size to 3", and turn it on full blast, it doesnt come out with as much force..
In a stock truck with a Roe, or Paxton, you can flow only so many CFMs of air..lets arbitrarily pick a number..400cfm..If you open up the heads, add a cam, etc, then you have more capacity for air to flow, say 600 cfm (This is like the larger hose) but guess what?..your Roe, or Paxton is still only flowing 400 CFM cuz it can only get so much air through it. (this is your hose being turned on full blast)..This is why people use smaller pulleys to get the roe turning faster. At some point you theoretically run out of the ability to spin the blower faster, and boost stops building..The way to overcome this is to put on a bigger blower, of which I dont know of any..
Another issue that could limit airflow is the throttle body, the air filter, etc. but Im not sure about that..
I realize this is a piss poor analogy, and someone correct me if I am on the wrong track here..

 

[FSTJACK]

He was spraying a TON of nitrous. His engine was built with that in mind, sleeved block etc. He was using a VERY tits multiport nitrous setup, similar to FstJacks.

Sorry Joe but this is what we kind of expected, just did not get the correct info from the Paxton Mfgr or from another member that claimed big HP with the Paxton.
Three of us with bigger motors have had almost identical results.........................
Mike's motor was not sleeved. The bottom end was very well built, the heads were basicly stock with good springs and valves.
Mike made around 700 RWHP on the Paxton and sprayed around 250 to get the track #'s he ran.

 

[LoveThisTruck]

airflow..its all about the airflow...think of it this way..your regular garden hose is like 3/4" diameter right?..If you turn on the hose full blast, it comes out the end with a bit of force. If you change the hose size to 3", and turn it on full blast, it doesnt come out with as much force..
In a stock truck with a Roe, or Paxton, you can flow only so many CFMs of air..lets arbitrarily pick a number..400cfm..If you open up the heads, add a cam, etc, then you have more capacity for air to flow, say 600 cfm (This is like the larger hose) but guess what?..your Roe, or Paxton is still only flowing 400 CFM cuz it can only get so much air through it. (this is your hose being turned on full blast)..This is why people use smaller pulleys to get the roe turning faster. At some point you theoretically run out of the ability to spin the blower faster, and boost stops building..The way to overcome this is to put on a bigger blower, of which I dont know of any..
Another issue that could limit airflow is the throttle body, the air filter, etc. but Im not sure about that..
I realize this is a piss poor analogy, and someone correct me if I am on the wrong track here..

No, that helps for some of the less experienced members like myself. I was considering going all out on my build, but after reading this and similar threads.... I'm just going to leave the heads/cam alone. Forge the thing and be happy with 650rwhp or so. Thanks for the explanation.

 

[blackviper]

I'm wondering if the cam is the issue?

 

[FSTJACK]

I'm wondering if the cam is the issue?

Cam is not the issue, my cam has only 9 degrees of overlap............

 

[blackviper]

Going back to Nowwhat's truck, what was the effect on boost with just the Stryker heads? What was the RWHP without spraying?

 

[FSTJACK]

Going back to Nowwhat's truck, what was the effect on boost with just the Stryker heads? What was the RWHP without spraying?

Mike (Nowhat) did not have Stryker heads, they were stock heads with good valves and springs.

 

[Ram From Hell]

I'm not saying that I dont belive you guys just trying to figure out why so much boost drop even with a smaller pully lol. to make only 4lbs is really wild.

If you keep in mind that we're moving as much air or more than other Paxton-equipped rides (depending on pulleys) and only seeing 4psi, you can get a sense of just how much higher the volumetric efficiencies our builds have resulted in. To achieve big numbers, you have to move a helluva lot of air.

I think our expectations were skewed by reports from Blakewilder before he vanished. My build was virtually identical to his, except for my intake. I don't see how we were misled by Paxton though. They couldn't have possibly foreseen just how voracious these engines would become, configured as they are. I'm pretty sure Paxton did not put their kit together with heavily built Viper engines in mind, so no bad on them.

Hell, even STS, with great success on every other vehicle they've built kits for, completely misread the Viper engine (even if it had been working properly from the onset). But hey, in all fairness, I wouldn't have the build I do without them. Well, them and several thousand dollars...

 

[pokeytemplar]

even with that tiny, and I could be wrong, but I dont think they will make the power a turbo set up will

Procharger can make just as much power to the wheels as any turbo setup. The Procharger F-3R-139 is capable of pushing a 1000HP NA engine to 2700HP and can produce up to 45psi. There are trade-offs with either solution. I feel that superchargers make for a better true street truck due to their linear power delivery. Turbos make for the better "all out" trucks using less crank HP to produce the power with peakier power delivery.

 

[JTS VENOM PERFORMANCE]

Procharger can make just as much power to the wheels as any turbo setup. The Procharger F-3R-139 is capable of pushing a 1000HP NA engine to 2700HP and can produce up to 45psi. There are trade-offs with either solution. I feel that superchargers make for a better true street truck due to their linear power delivery. Turbos make for the better "all out" trucks using less crank HP to produce the power with peakier power delivery.

on our trucks not gonna happen, they will only make around 1100hp, these engines are not v-8s they are totally different

 

[pokeytemplar]

Your current build, not the new bigger build

How are you guys going to deal with block twist? I see that Scrambler plans on a midplate on his motor. I know that Jack has a plate on his race truck. But with these ridiculous numbers soon to be put down by you guys won't block flex become an issue?

At the levels these guys are pushing it. I would want the main stud girdle that FSTJack has. Tying all of those mains together would greatly reduce cap walk and help with the flex.

 

[pokeytemplar]

on our trucks not gonna happen, they will only make around 1100hp, these engines are not v-8s they are totally different

What do you mean? With the F2? V-8, v-10 they are all just air pumps.