Failure of Lehman Bros.

[ChrisAZ]

I believe wholeheartedly in setting the example. The leader sets the example for the rest. What has our Government done for years to set the example? They have spent more than they have. They have borrowed with no plan or realistic ability to pay back. What have Americans in general done? We have followed the lead and now we're all in deep trouble. It's time to raise taxes and cut spending. Quit sending money outside the US. We need to worry about our own. We need to pay our share of taxes and expect our elected officials to spend our money wisely or better yet, don;t spend it at all but use it to pay down our debt. What does anyone do that hits a financial crunch and wants to get out of it? We cut our spending, sell our frivilous assets, take a second or third job and pay our dues to get back on track. It's time we pay our dues. Unfortunatley, we are mostly lazy SOB's that need to be deep in a depression and forced to change rather than being proactive and doing what makes good common sense.

I for one am willing to pay more in taxes because I am making a good living and I am willing to do my share. That being said, I am not willing to pay more taxes knowing my money will be pissed away as I know it will be now. If the President were to take the lead and show that spending is being cut drastically, we are no longer sending billions to aid countries like Georgia, and then ask for a tax hike, I will say yes to that. We're due for a reality check. Do we want it to be voluntary or involuntary in the form of a massive depression?

 

[FerrariTruck]

This why I think the U.S. is going under. Everybody (the big companys') are scracthin for the last 2cents outta everything. Its not to long that hooker headers annouced they are going to china as well as the Visegrips pliers.
If you really want to help we need to strictly buy american and recirculate our own money in the country. I know this is not shocking but see a huge
tanker like this roll into the L.A. harbor shows you what really is hurting us.
(on top of bush 8 year term )

 

[Prof]

I believe wholeheartedly in setting the example. The leader sets the example for the rest. What has our Government done for years to set the example? They have spent more than they have. They have borrowed with no plan or realistic ability to pay back. What have Americans in general done? We have followed the lead and now we're all in deep trouble. It's time to raise taxes and cut spending. Quit sending money outside the US. We need to worry about our own. We need to pay our share of taxes and expect our elected officials to spend our money wisely or better yet, don;t spend it at all but use it to pay down our debt. What does anyone do that hits a financial crunch and wants to get out of it? We cut our spending, sell our frivilous assets, take a second or third job and pay our dues to get back on track. It's time we pay our dues. Unfortunatley, we are mostly lazy SOB's that need to be deep in a depression and forced to change rather than being proactive and doing what makes good common sense.

I for one am willing to pay more in taxes because I am making a good living and I am willing to do my share. That being said, I am not willing to pay more taxes knowing my money will be pissed away as I know it will be now. If the President were to take the lead and show that spending is being cut drastically, we are no longer sending billions to aid countries like Georgia, and then ask for a tax hike, I will say yes to that. We're due for a reality check. Do we want it to be voluntary or involuntary in the form of a massive depression?

I resemble that statement!

Can we all have a huge AMEN!
__________________

 

[jelms]

I believe wholeheartedly in setting the example. The leader sets the example for the rest. What has our Government done for years to set the example? They have spent more than they have. They have borrowed with no plan or realistic ability to pay back. What have Americans in general done? We have followed the lead and now we're all in deep trouble. It's time to raise taxes and cut spending. Quit sending money outside the US. We need to worry about our own. We need to pay our share of taxes and expect our elected officials to spend our money wisely or better yet, don;t spend it at all but use it to pay down our debt. What does anyone do that hits a financial crunch and wants to get out of it? We cut our spending, sell our frivilous assets, take a second or third job and pay our dues to get back on track. It's time we pay our dues. Unfortunatley, we are mostly lazy SOB's that need to be deep in a depression and forced to change rather than being proactive and doing what makes good common sense.

I for one am willing to pay more in taxes because I am making a good living and I am willing to do my share. That being said, I am not willing to pay more taxes knowing my money will be pissed away as I know it will be now. If the President were to take the lead and show that spending is being cut drastically, we are no longer sending billions to aid countries like Georgia, and then ask for a tax hike, I will say yes to that. We're due for a reality check. Do we want it to be voluntary or involuntary in the form of a massive depression?

Great post. I have at times tried to express your views on taxes but have fallen very short of your post. Well thought out and very well spoken:congrats:

-jeff

 

[wheredwhogo?]

Great post. I have at times tried to express your views on taxes but have fallen very short of your post. Well thought out and very well spoken:congrats:

-jeff

with all that being said...im just throwing this out there, i am by NO means an expert, but with the current tax laws there are way too many loopholes for people to NOT pay taxes. Would a flat tax on everything bring in more tax revenue than our current tax system?

 

[jelms]

with all that being said...im just throwing this out there, i am by NO means an expert, but with the current tax laws there are way too many loopholes for people to NOT pay taxes. Would a flat tax on everything bring in more tax revenue than our current tax system?

I am by no means a tax expert at all. I believe if you do a search on that subject you might find a couple of posts here by more informed people than me on this subject.

I do pay a lot of taxes as a small business owner. And I do agree with ChrisAZ comments about spending my money more prudently. One thing to remember, most of the loopholes are for people like me that can afford a tax accountant to be informed and get all those loopholes. Does a man working on the Ford assembly line have the same situation as me??? I think not....

For those that are more informed please answer this good question... I will try to read up some more on the subject, but a flat tax doesn't seem like it is going to get any support from the two party system we are under now....

-jeff

 

[bigike]

well Prof I can only say what my situation and many around me is.

On the contrary GW is not Oil........... these are publicly held companies that employ honest hard working people.

Big Oil is not much different than big education, save for a few more hours of hard work.

And when hard times fall on me I wont be bitching about how I can't get a job, I will get a job ANY job that will tide me over while I look to improve my situation. Because after all I AM THE ONLY ONE THAT CAN IMPROVE MY SITUATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[bigike]

with all that being said...im just throwing this out there, i am by NO means an expert, but with the current tax laws there are way too many loopholes for people to NOT pay taxes. Would a flat tax on everything bring in more tax revenue than our current tax system?

I think you are right........... you know like how a person making 20,000 doesn't pay any taxes or how some people actually get back more money than they put in............. "poor people don't pay taxes, rich carry the burden and the middle class pay there dues" Freedom ain't free right boys!?!?!

 

[Prof]

with all that being said...im just throwing this out there, i am by NO means an expert, but with the current tax laws there are way too many loopholes for people to NOT pay taxes. Would a flat tax on everything bring in more tax revenue than our current tax system?

I don't think anyone really knows the answer to your question...and therein lies the problem. Another issue is the diversity of proposals...flat tax, fair tax, sales tax only, and a multitude of variations...I did a quick search and found support for both sides of the revenue generated for each of the major tax code replacement proposals.

I think that the philosophy of a revision is one of the important aspects. Currently we have a system that rewards those who can construct ways to avoid (not evade) taxation. Most of the proposals to change try to delete the exceptions to the law and simplify.

Maybe one of our CPA's here will be able to direct us to some good comparative articles that look objectively at the different approaches...but getting the change approved and installed is going to be a battle.

 

[Prof]

...And when hard times fall on me I wont be bitching about how I can't get a job, I will get a job ANY job that will tide me over while I look to improve my situation. Because after all I AM THE ONLY ONE THAT CAN IMPROVE MY SITUATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hope that you don't face that situation. Your attitude about pulling yourself up by the boot straps is pure American culture and is to be lauded. The problem once again is in the details.

An example...if there are several small children in the house there may not be jobs available that pay enough to cover expenses associated with taking that job. (transportation, child care, etc.) so the decision to not work may well be a bottom line financial decision...

But I hear your philosophy and I concur...in the end the only resource that we should depend on is ourselves. Some just find themselves in situations that do not allow for movement forward without assistance of some sort, and in many instances it is not because of their inaction or poor decisions. Often it is just a bad hand that has been dealt by circumstances...i.e. the mortgage market going upside down.

That is what our government is for...to avoid as many of those circumstances that cause hardship despite the best efforts of our citizens. I also have little empathy for the employees at Lehman Brothers that were getting seven figure bonuses 18 months ago...I do feel for the owners of the cleaners they used to use, the guy who used to do their lawn, and the nanny that used to take care of their children...they are blameless, but in deep shit now.

Nearly 200,000 people in the financial services industry have lost their jobs in the past 4 years. Not all of them were highly compensated. Many were the mid-level and lower level people who did the grunt work...those strong backs, are now bent with the burden of debt and declining assets and may never recover from the problems they are experiencing.

 

[bigike]

To the tune of Taxes................ NOT INCLUDING SALES TAX.

I've maid 97,654 this year my take home is 63,302.............. If I ain't paying my fair share I don't know what I'm doing.......

Now let me keep more of my money, I will buy more stuff. I will pay more taxes, I will insure that more people have jobs. No one has ever Taxed there way out of a rescission.................. and if you horde your money you only do that much more damage to the market (THE GREAT DEPRESSION!) But that's trickle down economics..........and it's bad

 

[thjones3]

I don't have much to add, but this is an interesting read. I think it is next to impossible for this country to make the changes that need to be made, at least with the people we currently have "representing" us. It just won't happen. Most of congress and the executive branch need to be replaced with people who actually are looking out for the interests of the country and not just for their own self-service. Oil and gas produced here should stay here. Most food produced here should stay here. Why does everything have to go to the "global market"? No, seriously. Why? I don't claim to have the answers, but if we are in such bad shape, why do we give (or throw) our resources away?

It really doesn't matter what I or you say. By that I mean, are you going to call your congressman or the president and give him/her your opinion? Do you think they would actually listen? Especially since most politicians are on some corporate/lobbyist payrolls. A congressman MAY pay attention if they receive enough pressure from the people of their district. I don't know. :dontknow: All I do is shrug my shoulders and vote for the politician that best represents my views and who I think is the most sincere in their desire to fix the things that need fixing. Usually I end up disappointed...

 

[Scrambler1]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. I lose 50% of my income to taxes, federal, state, etc. Starting Jan 1 I work into June for the government. I'm pretty sure that I'm paying my fair share of the tax situation and no one will convince me otherwise. I'm a huge fan of going to a national sales tax. It's my money, if I want to spend it thats my decision, if I want to invest it thats also my decision.

No one in our government is talking about raising taxes to lower the national debt. The republicans are going to continue to blow money outside this country. Democrats want to give more handouts to the do nothings of this country and require more taxes. I don't agree with either, especially the latter. There is zero reason the government can't get by on their current tax income. It's time to hold them accountable for their spending. If I get in financial trouble I don't get a pay raise, neither should they. Cut the bullshit and get us back where we need to be. I'm not willing to give them any more of MY income so they can piss it down a hole.

 

[Cudajon]

Ahh, good ol' taxes. Even if INCOME tax is abolished, around 25% of your income is potentially gone. Know how? FICA!! I've seen pay stubs where FICA is equivalent to the Federal withholdings.

F ***ed
I nto
C aring
A **holes

It's this socialism which is unsustainable, and we are reaping the Public debts. Many government "enterprises" are a losing proposition. Look at tax and spend Social Security, look at Fannie F'in Mae, look at AMTRAC, look all around you and you can see how the government is about as efficient as 30 grit sandpaper would be at porting your heads.

IMO Ayn Rand had it right, we need not only a separation of Church and State, but a separation of Economics and State as well. The FED would never have put us into this situation had it not existed .

We can say that their are shysters in industry, look at the guy that has been paid $100m over the course of 4 yrs as CEO of Lehman. But when we look at the bigger pictures, overwhelmingly as a whole the shysters are in Washington touting for the "Little guy".

 

[Prof]

IMO Ayn Rand had it right, we need not only a separation of Church and State, but a separation of Economics and State as well.

And just who is John Gault anyway?

 

[iraqivet01]

The way the market going, I can only hope to get the door greeter job at Walmart when I go turn 70.
Of course by then I will have to know Chinesse to talk to the management.

 

[Prof]

The way the market going, I can only hope to get the door greeter job at Walmart when I go turn 70.
Of course by then I will have to know Chinesse to talk to the management.

Your comments are more insightful than you or I dare imagine.

 

[Cudajon]

Didn't ya know, ROTC is making cadets learn it anyway j/k.. actually they are giving a nice Express scholarship to Chinese majors... wonder why....

 

[iraqivet01]

Your comments are more insightful than you or I dare imagine.

Whoever becomes President, (Don't really care at this point) they are going to have their hands full. We can only pray they will lead us into a direction that will turn things around.

Were living in a very Historical time. Our grandchildren will learn about this in history class. Hopefully when the dust settles in the upcoming years, it will have some kind of happy ending. :dontknow:

 

[HDVIPER]

Whoever becomes President, (Don't really care at this point) they are going to have their hands full. We can only pray they will lead us into a direction that will turn things around.

Were living in a very Historical time. Our grandchildren will learn about this in history class. Hopefully when the dust settles in the upcoming years, it will have some kind of happy ending. :dontknow:

Boy aint that the truth! My son is 3 mos. old, when he's in high school, I've got a feeling they're going to be talking about this time in our lives. I wonder how it will turn out? I'm more than a little concerned as to what his options will be when he gets to be of working age. We can only hope that whoever becomes President will do the best for our youngest citizens and their future... :dontknow: