HOLLYWOOD MORONS SUDDENLY CLAM UP

[TNVIPER]

Michael Moore is a quarter pounder with cheese ! ! !:idea: :idea: :idea:

Why yes, yes he is..and while a qtr pounder is bad for a person's heart he is bad for the heart of the U.S.

 

[ViperJeff]

I going to blame some of this on the media.

The media will show what they think will get them the most viewership reguardless if its the truth or not.

They will show 30-50 protesters from 5 different angles making it seem like its happening all accross the contry and its not. If the media would start showing the fight against instead of the fear and distruction, we might have a chance. Terrorists use the media much like the US did in Desert Storm. CNN would report what would happen and the US Military would know the extent of there work. Terrorist are using the same thing today. They commit the most horrific of crimes against even there own people and then sit back and watch it over and over on CNN.

We need to turn that around, start showing just the mangled bodies of terrorists and show it over and over. Ingrain in there minds what there fate will be.

The media will always say that they cannot be held responsible for what they report (fact or fiction). But they need to realize that what they report furthers the actions of those who would like to kill us.

On the Islamic issue. When I was in Desert Storm and after the war was over, I met several gentlemen from Kuwait, very nice and gracious. In fact where I was at in the UAE, there were people from every country to in clude IRAQ and IRAN who wished and hoped for a better life because of the extremist

my .000000000002

Jeff

 

[YellowFever]

Give all of Islam a wake up call.

Tell them if another act of Islamic terrorism is committed we will level Medina.

Next act will bring the total obliteration of Mecca..........

Next will be the Dome of the Rock.....

These bastards will never give up without our use of overwhelming and devastating weapons.....

It's time to put this shit to an end like we did in WWII.

Too bad our government has lost the nuts to do it.....

Read "Warrior Politics" by Robert Kaplan.....

SD

Here Here!!! So sayeth Django, so sayeth we all. Like you I fear that our government is too worried about "offending" other countries to handle this the way it should be handled. They would rather fight a battle where our troops are limited to what they can do instead of going in and kicking ass, which, in the long run, will cost more lives not less. What ever happened to walk softly and carry a big stick? (No sickness, that doesn't mean what you think) I fear the world that my 2 young grandchildren will inherit.

Jeff

 

[Ram From Hell]

The frustration exists on many sides of this issue...you're pain is evident, and completely justified...we (everyone, both sides) can only hope to learn and gain understand at sometime in the future.

If the roles were reversed, we would be looking for ways to attack the other side, hurt them, even employ terrorist tactics in an effort to preserve our way of life and beliefs...one philosophies terrorist is another philosophies freedom fighter.

Let's get back to trucks, this is hurting my brain!

Actually, the shoe kinda was on the other foot during the Inquisition.

I would like to think, however, that the human race has come a little farther along since then.

Also, ask yourself what right one group has to inflict harm on all others who happen to have a different point of view. It's one thing to spread your philosophy, and quite another to force it upon others by these acts.

 

[TheSickness]

There will never be peace in the Middle East......Never. The society is based on religon and controlled by Cleric's with fanatical views...Fanaticism breeds contempt for all others, including hatered for other people in their own country. Iraq and the Kurd's would be a good example..The Shia and the Shites another ect.....So let's just bomb them into oblivion Yeah , that will work :dontknow: That view with all due respect is just ignorant and buffers the very reason why the whole rest of the world hates us....It's our turn We only say that cause we have the means to do it.....

For example put yourself in a typical Iranian's shoes.....They hate their government and the military.....Only one thing will effect positive change in these areas .....................The people....!!!!!!!!!!!! It's always been the case through history, Revolution is the only way that will happen. The examples are far to many to list..One needs to only look at our own history to see this to be true.......This would all be alot easier to comprehend for people, if they have ever spent anytime killing these people....

I know that a very prominant person on this site is Lebanesse.....I wont say who because it's not my place. I will say he is prolly one of the finest men I have ever talked to, an honor to know, and a great human being.....I Love him like a brother...Some of you know who I refer to, most don't....

Better understanding of the people and why they hate us, would change some views......Maybe. We cant play savior to the world and impose our will with impunity w/o a back lash from those who don't understand us as a people......Freedom is the enemy of those who wish to breed hate and serve their own best self intrest.........REVOLUTION breeds new life and if you really sit back and think....It will be the only way the world can and ever will change...Sometimes for the worst...Mostly for the better :2in1:

 

[ViperJeff]

There will never be peace in the Middle East......Never. The society is based on religon and controlled by Cleric's with fanatical views...Fanaticism breeds contempt for all others, including hatered for other people in their own country. Iraq and the Kurd's would be a good example..The Shia and the Shites another ect.....So let's just bomb them into oblivion Yeah , that will work :dontknow: That view with all due respect is just ignorant and buffers the very reason why the whole rest of the world hates us....It's our turn We only say that cause we have the means to do it.....

For example put yourself in a typical Iranian's shoes.....They hate their government and the military.....Only one thing will effect positive change in these areas .....................The people....!!!!!!!!!!!! It's always been the case through history, Revolution is the only way that will happen. The examples are far to many to list..One needs to only look at our own history to see this to be true.......This would all be alot easier to comprehend for people, if they have ever spent anytime killing these people....

I know that a very prominant person on this site is Lebanesse.....I wont say who because it's not my place. I will say he is prolly one of the finest men I have ever talked to, an honor to know, and a great human being.....I Love him like a brother...Some of you know who I refer to, most don't....

Better understanding of the people and why they hate us, would change some views......Maybe. We cant play savior to the world and impose our will with impunity w/o a back lash from those who don't understand us as a people......Freedom is the enemy of those who wish to breed hate and serve their own best self intrest.........REVOLUTION breeds new life and if you really sit back and think....It will be the only way the world can and ever will change...Sometimes for the worst...Mostly for the better :2in1:

The voice of reason....and it came from Mikey

And when that happens, its best to sit back, take a deep breath and be less reactionary (word?) and use some common sense.

Because if we were really proponents of the afore mentioned nuke em all theory, just think, Idaho would be gone because of the arian nation, the entire south because of the kkk, wipe all the major cities off the map, crips, bloods etc and there's at least one idiot in every major city in the world that has a following. There will always be the Hatfields and MaCoys, Campbells and McDonalds and the Shia and Shites, so even if we nuked em all, there would still be two that don't see eye to eye

Right..........Mikey, Dave

I know things are cool now (until...........:2in1: )

Thanks Mikey, enjoyed your insight

Jeff

 

[TheSickness]

The voice of reason....and it came from Mikey

And when that happens, its best to sit back, take a deep breath and be less reactionary (word?) and use some common sense.

Because if we were really proponents of the afore mentioned nuke em all theory, just think, Idaho would be gone because of the arian nation, the entire south because of the kkk, wipe all the major cities off the map, crips, bloods etc and there's at least one idiot in every major city in the world that has a following. There will always be the Hatfields and MaCoys, Campbells and McDonalds and the Shia and Shites, so even if we nuked em all, there would still be two that don't see eye to eye

Right..........Mikey, Dave

I know things are cool now (until...........:2in1: )

Thanks Mikey, enjoyed your insight

Jeff

You're welcome Jeffy..........I do have short bursts of wisdom now and again I read that on the back of my Fruity Pebbles this morning..So I cant take any credit for it I have no problem with anyone personally until I am given just cause.. I will defend my freinds and family until death and if they are wrong, I'll be the first to kick em in the sack

 

[ViperJeff]

You're welcome Jeffy..........I do have short bursts of wisdom now and again I read that on the back of my Fruity Pebbles this morning..So I cant take any credit for it

And here I though you would be more of a Captain Crunch kind of guy :dontknow:

but then again, Bam Bam seems to fit

 

[OCBob]

We have ourselves (meaning our gov't) to blame for a lot of the hate and discontent that these people feel towards us. Iran? Shit, we supported the Shah and his brutal Stalinesque regime for years, all the while knowing full well what kind of hell he was subjecting his people to. We supported Saddam in the same fashion when he was then at war with Iran.

Then we wonder why these people hate us, and why they go to the far end of the spectrum when they do revolt? It's really quite simple. Throw in our virtual blanket of support for Israel and you have the recipe for this type of hate.

Now, that doesn't mean that I think we should be coddling these people. They are a threat to our nation and our citizens. This has to be addressed, there is no choice. I am not sure if there is any hope of educating them without violence.

 

[TheSickness]

We have ourselves (meaning our gov't) to blame for a lot of the hate and discontent that these people feel towards us. Iran? Shit, we supported the Shah and his brutal Stalinesque regime for years, all the while knowing full well what kind of hell he was subjecting his people to. We supported Saddam in the same fashion when he was then at war with Iran.

Then we wonder why these people hate us, and why they go to the far end of the spectrum when they do revolt? It's really quite simple. Throw in our virtual blanket of support for Israel and you have the recipe for this type of hate.

Now, that doesn't mean that I think we should be coddling these people. They are a threat to our nation and our citizens. This has to be addressed, there is no choice. I am not sure if there is any hope of educating them without violence.

The choices made by the past 2 Presidents and Congress are the main culprit...........Whatever happened to the Whig party Unfortunately you are correct with the need to fight now. We have no choice it's kill or be killed 9/11 taught us that in a painful manner.
I am no pacifist by any stretch......But wouldn't the world be a far better place today if people where just a little more tolerant of each other ? In the equation of life and God, there really is no right or wrong, just a twisted sense of one's self importance and in some cases the twisting of one's faith to make indignities and Martyr's blend for a specific purpose to extend a fanatical view of what should be right for everyone..? Faith is a wonderful and spiritual thing and is always best kept out of Politics and other peoples faces......The Crusades are a prime example of what is wrong with Fanaticism..Look what they achieved in the name of God............Nothing They are still going on more then 2 Milena later to what avail ? Tolerance what a wonderful gift that was that he gave us, right up there with Free will The only hope there is to end these types of conflict lays at the feet of the country's people.....When they get tired of it, is when things happen......Those who forget their history are doomed to repeat it.........That was on the Frosted Flakes yesterday

 

[Wifey]

Kill em all and let God sort em out

 

[OCBob]

It goes back much farther than just the last 2 Presidents. Once we found out that we needed oil, and that these folks had it, things got jacked. We (again, I mean our gov't) have backstabbed every nation in that region at one time or another. Damn, Ronny Raygun was busy selling weapons to the Iranians at the same time we were supporting the Iraqis. Folks blame Carter for the Iran hostage crisis, he just happened to be in office when the whole house of cards came tumbling down. That shit went all the way back to Roosevelt and our installation of the Shah as the ruler of that country. If there is a country in that region that we can put on a list that we haven't screwed over, it is probably just because we haven't heard about it yet.

Now that being said, are the people in Iran any better off now than they were under the heel of the Shah? Probably not. They simply traded one tyrant for another, but at least this is a tryant of their own choosing. Every nation in that region should be swimming in cash, yet they are among the poorest people in the world. Some of this goes back to our dirty deals with the former leaders, but the new leaders haven't made it any better for the people.

I don't know what the answer is, or even if there is an answer. But until the citizens of those countries decide that they want to live in a free and modern society, it will never happen. It can't without the will of the people. And that is the part I don't understand. Given the choice between living in abject squalor under an iron fist, or living in a modern free state the choice would seem simple. But not for them for some reason. I find it hard to believe that religion could be the sole reason for that, but what do I know?

 

[Wifey]

Maybe we shoulda voted for Ross Perot when we had the chance -
did ya get that huh, did ya huh

 

[ViperJeff]

I don't know what the answer is, or even if there is an answer. But until the citizens of those countries decide that they want to live in a free and modern society, it will never happen. It can't without the will of the people. And that is the part I don't understand. Given the choice between living in abject squalor under an iron fist, or living in a modern free state the choice would seem simple. But not for them for some reason. I find it hard to believe that religion could be the sole reason for that, but what do I know?

Its simple.....

The vast majority have no idea what your talking about, they only know what there taught, most are keep uneducated, no access to the outside world.

So how the hell would they know what choice to make

Not picking on you, because you would be right, only if....

 

[OCBob]

Its simple.....

The vast majority have no idea what your talking about, they only know what there taught, most are keep uneducated, no access to the outside world.

So how the hell would they know what choice to make

Not picking on you, because you would be right, only if....

That may be true of some of them, but Iran was a very "westernized" country at the time of the Islamic revolution. How do you explain the Saudi's who hate us with a passion? Hell, the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11 lived in this country. They could see with their own eyes the type of society we have, yet they were willing to die in order to kill Americans. The answer to that question just isn't that simple.

I have had the opportunity to spend some time in downtown Bierut, courtesy of our government. The people that were attacking us were not uneducated then and the folks that attack us now are not.

You do not have to be educated to know that there has to be something better.

I don't think you are picking on me, I love good debate. Everyone can learn a lot through it.

 

[ViperJeff]

That may be true of some of them, but Iran was a very "westernized" country at the time of the Islamic revolution. How do you explain the Saudi's who hate us with a passion? Hell, the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11 lived in this country. They could see with their own eyes the type of society we have, yet they were willing to die in order to kill Americans. The answer to that question just isn't that simple.

My error, I was just considering those that live and have lived in those countries their entire life, without the benefit of travel to other countries.

The ones your referring to only have a single agenda....to kill....anyone

 

[OCBob]

My error, I was just considering those that live and have lived in those countries their entire life, without the benefit of travel to other countries.

The ones your referring to only have a single agenda....to kill....anyone

No error on your part. I was simply pointing out that each person there is unique in some sense and has their own reasons for not rising up. I am sure that the prevailing reason is fear, but that is the first thing they must overcome if they are to ever live free.

 

[TheSickness]

I respectfully disagree with you Jeff...Many of the people we are fighting are students at Universities..People like Osama Bin Bonehead are very intelligent, in fact many are sent here for education. The countries are poor but their places of worship and the Clerics are not poor, for some reason. Hell they even have enough money to finance terror strikes all over the world in a coordinated effort...Never underestimate your opponant....That's when you lose

Bob while you speak from a place only few of us can, I disagree with your timeline. The last 2 Presidents have turned a blind eye to a growing problem that bit us in the Ass. Yes you may go back even further then you did and pull out examples of failure then....Agreed ! We did not need to be in Iraq when we did this time. Our efforts needed to be directed at the Major contributing factor of all that is wrong with the middle east. Iran and Syria. They are the soul cause of all of it. They alone sponser 98 % of all terrorist activities and 100 % of all the hate. It's cyclical and vicious .

 

[OCBob]

Mikey, I agree wholeheartedly that the timing of the Iraq invasion was wrong. It was based on personal agenda and piss poor planning. But I tend to look at the region as a whole. All of the governments there gladly harbor terrorist factions. Iran is certainly a major threat to our way of life, yet we are just dicking around with them. The Syrians are nothing more than a gang of thugs, exporting their hate around the region.

I find the humanitarian aspect of the Iraq conflict commendable. Unfortunatly that was not the underlying reason we are there, and in reality has little chance of succeeding. Turmoil rules in the region, sadly there is no reason to believe that we can change that. All we can realistically do is continue to hunt down and eliminate the leaders of the groups that mean us harm. But, we are not even commited to that. We need to cut the head off of this beast, which means identifying the leaders whether heads of state or simply heads of these groups and sending them off to Allah. al-Assad in Syria, Khamenei and Ahmadinejad in Iran, Bin-laden, these folks have got to go. But we must be careful not to try to implement our "own guys" when that happens. History has taught that much.

 

[TheSickness]

Mikey, I agree wholeheartedly that the timing of the Iraq invasion was wrong. It was based on personal agenda and piss poor planning. But I tend to look at the region as a whole. All of the governments there gladly harbor terrorist factions. Iran is certainly a major threat to our way of life, yet we are just dicking around with them. The Syrians are nothing more than a gang of thugs, exporting their hate around the region.

I find the humanitarian aspect of the Iraq conflict commendable. Unfortunatly that was not the underlying reason we are there, and in reality has little chance of succeeding. Turmoil rules in the region, sadly there is no reason to believe that we can change that. All we can realistically do is continue to hunt down and eliminate the leaders of the groups that mean us harm. But, we are not even commited to that. We need to cut the head off of this beast, which means identifying the leaders whether heads of state or simply heads of these groups and sending them off to Allah. al-Assad in Syria, Khamenei and Ahmadinejad in Iran, Bin-laden, these folks have got to go. But we must be careful not to try to implement our "own guys" when that happens. History has taught that much.

Noted............:rock: