Azmal
Full Access Member
Migrating from the Philosophy Thread
http://www.vtcoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27135&page=3
The Skeptics Thread
My focus here is to bring up issues that no one seems to want to discuss. Predominantly concerning issues of supernatural beings be it Zeus, Allah, Yahweh, Jesus, or Santa. Also concerning things such as luck and karma. Even extending to basis of morality and beyond. And then there's the vast array of superstitions and pseudo medical practices. Can't forget things like Astrology either.
It shouldn't become a bashing session for anyone but I hope it can be insightful if not enlightening at least in terms of views not commonly explored. I don't want to insult anyone but I don't care less if someone is offended on these matters. Why should I? We all have differing views and it's up to you whether or not you decide to get upset over what I believe or disbelieve.
If I'm though to be simply 'rocking the boat' then so be it. It's not too far off from being true but that is not the sole motivation. I feel strongly that one should never shrink away from controversy.
Why here? Well, why not. It's no more off topic than much of the stuff here anyhow.
Guess I'll start off with religion and gods or creation but I won't go in depth for now. There's much to be had in the skeptics pool.
But I'll start by adding a sort of preemptive statement for those who might say or feel that these things shouldn't be talked about, are not open for discussion, don't concern science, are matters of faith, would rather agree to disagree, and so on, all because these things are sacred or holy or what have you... But why should religion or a god be granted a special privilege? Why shouldn't religion or a god be every bit up for scrutiny as matters of politics, or which turbo or supercharger is better for a truck? In fact I think things of which you hold with the most conviction should be as far removed from mere faith as possible! But somehow over time, religion and faith has found itself with a special position in our society; entirely too free from skeptical inquiry. In fact the very idea of faith is construed in such a way as to make itself unfalsifiable, self fulfilling, and immune from the effects of logic, reason, and most importantly, evidence.
On Creation- Dawkins -"The standard creationist argument- therefore they must have had a designer.
This argument, shoots itself in the foot- any designer capable of designing something really complex has to be even more complex Himself. And that's before we even start on the other things He's expected to do, like forgive sins, bless marriages, listen to prayers, favor our side in a war, disapprove of our sex lives, and so on."
A few more things and food for thought.
Luck - This is one of those things we all or at least most of us talk about or refer to frequently including myself. When I say it, or perhaps most of us, I'm referring to a fortunate outcome of the probability cycle. But not everyone actually
Astrology and Horoscopes - It's utterly surprising how many adhere to this as though it were true without a second though. I attribute that mainly to people not really knowing what it is. I realized this was gonna take up a lot of typing time and it requires a good bit of background history of how ancient people interpreted their world and sky as well as an explanation of how the earth has a wobble of axis that makes the horoscopes given today even months off lol so I just thought it'd be better to link something if you think my skepticism is misplaced. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1B3GGGL_enUS286US286&q=astrology+skeptic&btnG=Search
Karma - This may surprise you but I feel 'karma' is true. At least in more of a de facto sense. Individual karma that many of us tend to imagine is unlikely to exist. I think the Karma the Buddhists believe in is a global karma (I haven't looked into this so I may be mistaken) and I think if you were to ask a Buddaist they perhaps they would imagine a sort of spiritual energy encompassing the world and when one does a deed good or bad it affects the global energy level for good or bad and the spiritual energy sort of influences us.
Frankly I see it as social dynamics. Do a good deed; somebody benefits; perhaps they return the favor to someone else and it's a sort of chain reaction. So I guess I see karma as kind of like stating the obvious with a mystical twist. So I wouldn't say I 'believe in' karma. Hope this makes sense
So, hope we can enjoy a good discussion. If you've got a differing opinion just toss it out. You don't learn anything new from an agreement after all.
http://www.vtcoa.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27135&page=3
The Skeptics Thread
My focus here is to bring up issues that no one seems to want to discuss. Predominantly concerning issues of supernatural beings be it Zeus, Allah, Yahweh, Jesus, or Santa. Also concerning things such as luck and karma. Even extending to basis of morality and beyond. And then there's the vast array of superstitions and pseudo medical practices. Can't forget things like Astrology either.
It shouldn't become a bashing session for anyone but I hope it can be insightful if not enlightening at least in terms of views not commonly explored. I don't want to insult anyone but I don't care less if someone is offended on these matters. Why should I? We all have differing views and it's up to you whether or not you decide to get upset over what I believe or disbelieve.
If I'm though to be simply 'rocking the boat' then so be it. It's not too far off from being true but that is not the sole motivation. I feel strongly that one should never shrink away from controversy.
Why here? Well, why not. It's no more off topic than much of the stuff here anyhow.
Guess I'll start off with religion and gods or creation but I won't go in depth for now. There's much to be had in the skeptics pool.
But I'll start by adding a sort of preemptive statement for those who might say or feel that these things shouldn't be talked about, are not open for discussion, don't concern science, are matters of faith, would rather agree to disagree, and so on, all because these things are sacred or holy or what have you... But why should religion or a god be granted a special privilege? Why shouldn't religion or a god be every bit up for scrutiny as matters of politics, or which turbo or supercharger is better for a truck? In fact I think things of which you hold with the most conviction should be as far removed from mere faith as possible! But somehow over time, religion and faith has found itself with a special position in our society; entirely too free from skeptical inquiry. In fact the very idea of faith is construed in such a way as to make itself unfalsifiable, self fulfilling, and immune from the effects of logic, reason, and most importantly, evidence.
On Creation- Dawkins -"The standard creationist argument- therefore they must have had a designer.
This argument, shoots itself in the foot- any designer capable of designing something really complex has to be even more complex Himself. And that's before we even start on the other things He's expected to do, like forgive sins, bless marriages, listen to prayers, favor our side in a war, disapprove of our sex lives, and so on."
A few more things and food for thought.
Luck - This is one of those things we all or at least most of us talk about or refer to frequently including myself. When I say it, or perhaps most of us, I'm referring to a fortunate outcome of the probability cycle. But not everyone actually
Astrology and Horoscopes - It's utterly surprising how many adhere to this as though it were true without a second though. I attribute that mainly to people not really knowing what it is. I realized this was gonna take up a lot of typing time and it requires a good bit of background history of how ancient people interpreted their world and sky as well as an explanation of how the earth has a wobble of axis that makes the horoscopes given today even months off lol so I just thought it'd be better to link something if you think my skepticism is misplaced. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1B3GGGL_enUS286US286&q=astrology+skeptic&btnG=Search
Karma - This may surprise you but I feel 'karma' is true. At least in more of a de facto sense. Individual karma that many of us tend to imagine is unlikely to exist. I think the Karma the Buddhists believe in is a global karma (I haven't looked into this so I may be mistaken) and I think if you were to ask a Buddaist they perhaps they would imagine a sort of spiritual energy encompassing the world and when one does a deed good or bad it affects the global energy level for good or bad and the spiritual energy sort of influences us.
Frankly I see it as social dynamics. Do a good deed; somebody benefits; perhaps they return the favor to someone else and it's a sort of chain reaction. So I guess I see karma as kind of like stating the obvious with a mystical twist. So I wouldn't say I 'believe in' karma. Hope this makes sense
So, hope we can enjoy a good discussion. If you've got a differing opinion just toss it out. You don't learn anything new from an agreement after all.
Last edited by a moderator:
