Tuning my Vec III and PBJ

[Speed Racer]

I recently returned from St. Louis and having Joe Donovan http://www.performancebyjoe.com/ tune my Vec III. Going in I had problems with my truck shifting at odd times, power loss, blowing black smoke on occasions, and horrible gas mileage (6-8mpg). But, I had my dyno sheets with me. I told Joe that I had great horsepower but had the above issues. Well he said he could set the fuel right, improve my mileage, and make the truck work right with the Roe s/c but the shifting thing was due to a problem in the PCM reflash that Roe had sent out and had programmed to stage II. Joe carried my Wife Wanda and I down to the car rental place where I rented a New charger (woot) and got to test drive it (trying to talk Wanda into a new Challenger) and we went to the zoo while Joe was working on my truck.


We left the zoo (which is like 10 minutes away from Joe's) to check on the progress. Joe showed me the new dyno runs (and I will post these asap) but here's the thing: they were 100 hp less than the previous ones. Joe said (after talking to Sean several times about the power drop offs and shifting that these problems we're (again) in the PCM tune and that Sean had noted this in other q/c) and the other guys dyno was WAY not right. Now I had thought this too when I was getting 650 hp and others on this forum with built motors and more performance mods were not. Joe worked some more while I rented a motel room as we got some ZZZ's. We went back at 5pm he had just test drove it. Joe said it was ready and explained all he did. Wanda and I then met Joe's wife, his son, and another customer named Tom (real nice guy) that had a Viper. Joe invited us to eat dinner with them and we went to a nice Tex-Mex place downtown that had the BEST margarita's in the world and (he wouldn't let me pay for dinner either thanks! Joe)
So here's what we came away with:

Joe worked from 8am to 5 pm on my truck (no lunch), Tuned my Vec (I got a flat curve on fuel now almost 12's all the way), 556.08 HP, 572.90 RWT @97 degrees temp)better gas mileage (10.5 on the way home), a LOT of information, good fellowship, LOTS of information on you guys (Dave T, Justin, Dennis, everyone else you know who you are LOL), and just a great time for me and my lady (for 350.00). I actually felt like I was ripping Joe off.

So to sum this up guys, if you can get your wheels to Joe in St. Louis or get him to you, you couldn't find a more capable, knowledgable (over 15 years with Dodge), and just a nice guy. He, and his family are the best.


Thanks, Joe!


Perry Parsons

 

[Prof]

Great endorsement Perry...by all reports Joe has created a wonderful reputation for himself...its great to know that we have another VEC expert and someone that is comfortable with the Roe TMTS.

Thanks for the excellent review...

 

[WAZZSUP]

Great write up....but a picture of you guys sharing a margarita after a hard day would have been perfect.

 

[FlyingLow]

What kind of flash do you have? A blower flash should leave the timing stock so the VEC can do all the timing. BTW who was the other guy's dyno that was way not right?

 

[JMB Justin]

Congrats Perry! Joe is a helluva guy both as a tuner and as an individual, im glad you had a great experience.
Justin

 

[tinygiants]

That sounds like a great experience. I need to find a shop like that in the NW. I am glad you were able to get good results.
Is Roe going to get your PCM reflashed to correct the shifting?

 

[ViperTruck2933]

Congrats! Joe is absolutely the best. Glad you got hooked up with him. :rock:

 

[rottenronnie]

Tuning seems to be a HUGE issue with the supercharged trucks.

Two of the superchaged quad cabs around here (one a Paxton and one a Roe) run only 4 or 5 M.P.H. faster than my very lightly modded n.a. truck. and not 12-15 M.P.H. faster which is where they should be.

 

[tinygiants]

:idea:

Tuning seems to be a HUGE issue with the supercharged trucks.

Two of the superchaged quad cabs around here (one a Paxton and one a Roe) run only 4 or 5 M.P.H. faster than my very lightly modded n.a. truck. and not 12-15 M.P.H. faster which is where they should be.

I am dissaponted enough, that I am looking to send my truck to DC over the winter.

 

[kyle's srt10]

Congrats man:rock: Joe is a heck of a guy and knows his stuff!! So when we going to meet up so I can check that roe out

 

[mauiSRT/10]

Thats awesome dude. $350 is a cheap price to pay for peace of mind and a proper tune.

Good post. Wish I had a PBJ on my island.

patrick

 

[rottenronnie]

:idea:
I am dissaponted enough, that I am looking to send my truck to DC over the winter.

I haven't bought a supercharger (yet). It seems like they need some sorting out.

The problem seems to be with the flashed factory box and the VEC III properly communicating, as far as I can tell. I mean the supercharger itself is just an air pump and should just, well, pump air.

I was hoping the pre-programmed cards provide by Roe would provide the vast majority of the proper tune and power and then I could fine tune it myself.

Maybe someone can provide some insights...???

All I know is the guys I have run into at the track with the SRT-10s, are only making an additional 50 or 60 horsepower with their superchargers.

 

[tinygiants]

I haven't bought a supercharger (yet). It seems like they need some sorting out.

The problem seems to be with the flashed factory box and the VEC III properly communicating, as far as I can tell. I mean the supercharger itself is just an air pump and should just, well, pump air.

I was hoping the pre-programmed cards provide by Roe would provide the vast majority of the proper tune and power and then I could fine tune it myself.

Maybe someone can provide some insights...???

All I know is the guys I have run into at the track are only making an additional 50 or 60 horsepower with their superchargers.

I went from 373 to 490 by adding the supercharger. Now I want more. I am also not convinced that my tune is agreeing with my truck. It seems to me my truck is not "normal" in the sense that it was anemic to start with. So I really want to let a competent tuner have at it.

 

[rottenronnie]

I went from 373 to 490 by adding the supercharger. Now I want more. I am also not convinced that my tune is agreeing with my truck. It seems to me my truck is not "normal" in the sense that it was anemic to start with. So I really want to let a competent tuner have at it.

At the risk of bringing down the wrath of God- From what I have seen, there are no competent supercharger system tuners in our area (Alberta).

That is why I need a great "basic tune", hopefully provided by the cards from Roe, to start with.

PS Nothing to do with Roe or anyone else on this forum, but I saw (locally) a supercharged H2 run 17 seconds at 79 M.P.H. A supercharged
Chevy SS run 83 M.P.H. A supercharged Escalade run 81 M.P.H. And the depressing list goes on....

 

[PBJ]

Hey guys,
Let me say thanks for the kind words. Perry, I hope everything is cool. I usually like to do a little more street time after my tunes to make sure everything is good, but the rain put the brakes to that. I will say the combination of the auto and the 4.56 gears really robs the power on paper. If I remember correctly we picked up 43-44 hp and around 30-35 ftlbs...that is not bad gains for just a tune. It was one of the nicest air fuel cuves I have had to start with in quite a while. Sean definately spent some time to come up with the truck cards. Every vehicle is different and likes a little different tune...so to come up with a generic tune has to be difficult. As far as sorting out the package, I don't think I would go that far...the trans/shifting issues has nothing to do with the supercharger package. The supercharger itself has a lot of potential...5-6 pounds is nowhere in its efficiency range. The cast pistons and the powdered rods are more of the power issue here. Even with knock sensors I had to pull plugs between pulls to find all of the power I felt safe with. I have tuned alot of Roe blower cars and I know you can make killer power and great ETs from Sean's kits. This is a new kit and my first on a truck, so we all have some things to try and see what we can get away with. I have a '06 at the shop now that is getting, pistons, rods, and a different pulley, so hopefully we will make enough power to show up some of the Paxton guys . Alright, enough of my BSing....thanks again Perry and hope to see you again.
Joe

 

[BigBlackQC]

QC Roe hp results

Tinygiants, I would definitely agree that your truck seems to be a bit low on the factory hp. My dyno with just filter and exhaust netted 418hp, a 45 hp difference. Also, 120hp gain on the blower is not too bad. I think the RCs gain about 140-150hp, but the auto tranny kills some of the gains, so your 120 gain seems pretty close.

For the QC guys, what could we do to achieve between 550-600rwhp consistently? maybe 50 shot of N20 added to the Roe? maybe 1-2 more lbs of boost?

 

[rottenronnie]

Hey guys,
Let me say thanks for the kind words. Perry, I hope everything is cool. I usually like to do a little more street time after my tunes to make sure everything is good, but the rain put the brakes to that. I will say the combination of the auto and the 4.56 gears really robs the power on paper. If I remember correctly we picked up 43-44 hp and around 30-35 ftlbs...that is not bad gains for just a tune. It was one of the nicest air fuel cuves I have had to start with in quite a while. Sean definately spent some time to come up with the truck cards. Every vehicle is different and likes a little different tune...so to come up with a generic tune has to be difficult. As far as sorting out the package, I don't think I would go that far...the trans/shifting issues has nothing to do with the supercharger package. The supercharger itself has a lot of potential...5-6 pounds is nowhere in its efficiency range. The cast pistons and the powdered rods are more of the power issue here. Even with knock sensors I had to pull plugs between pulls to find all of the power I felt safe with. I have tuned alot of Roe blower cars and I know you can make killer power and great ETs from Sean's kits. This is a new kit and my first on a truck, so we all have some things to try and see what we can get away with. I have a '06 at the shop now that is getting, pistons, rods, and a different pulley, so hopefully we will make enough power to show up some of the Paxton guys . Alright, enough of my BSing....thanks again Perry and hope to see you again.
Joe

Joe, by "sorting out" I didn't mean that the Roe units weren't ready to use as is, and in no way was it a slam against what seems to be an excellent, well conceived product. I fully intend to purchased one of their units. If I have something to praise or slam, I have never been accused of beating around the bush.

I understand it must be difficult to come up with a generic tune for even the same year and same mods on two different vehicles.

I was hoping I could just buy the unit and install it and using the preprogrammed cards, have AT LEAST an additional 100 horsepower more than I had prior to the installation.

Is that too much to ask or will I still HAVE TO tune it after the install (even with the pre-programmed cards) to obtain even that much of a gain?

Thanks.

 

[ViperTruck2933]

For the QC guys, what could we do to achieve between 550-600rwhp consistently? maybe 50 shot of N20 added to the Roe? maybe 1-2 more lbs of boost?

I'd start with forged internals. Then you can see the full potential of the S/C and hit 600 rwhp with ease.

 

[tinygiants]

I was hoping I could just buy the unit and install it and using the preprogrammed cards, have AT LEAST an additional 100 horsepower more than I had prior to the installation.
Thanks.

I got 117 hp just by bolting her on and using stock ROE cards.

But I really believe my truck has the extra 40+ hp that PBJ was able to tune into the package.

 

[Prof]

BigBlackQC is right on...my RC started at 468 and with the Roe produced 620. Some others have done better. Joe's comments about individual trucks is very insightful. And his intent to push the Roe on a built motor is the correct way to go...would love to see Tim go the Roe route now that he has bolstered his internals...

As for me 620 on the street is plenty...and I believe very safe...I was the second install right after 1Fast400 and have had zero problems. But mine gets very little use...northern Illinois is not conducive to quantum amounts of torque and horse power about five or six months a year...