LETS TALK ENGINES!

[Slitherbeast]

I don't know what your pockets look like but if your calling that inexpensive they must be deep.....for what your goal is ill wait, let you do some real world pricing including getting the work done if your not an engine builder then get back to us......

I havn't mentioned any goals. All I am trying to figure is cost of the entire package of cam and heads. Seems all we ever heard about a short couple of years ago was blown engines! Prof's cracked up pistons and how weak the rods and pistons are in these engines when you crank up the HP. So when trying to add power , even with "just cam and heads" can I really afford not to , at least change rods and piston as insurance that the pistons don't grenade at the first sign of detonation! I feel the main caps are plenty strong stock as long as rpm's stay under 6000 . Hit a stock bottom ended good rod and piston engine with strykers and cam with a small, shot dual stage ,200 shot and keep it under 6000 rpm would be perfect for me . And alot of fun that could easily be drivin' across the country without issue

I have my opinion on what makes sense for a build I was just looking for some expert opinion for some discussion . Not for slandering anyone! Just simple forum discussion. Thanx for you time

 

[yellow446]

I don't know what your pockets look like but if your calling that inexpensive they must be deep.....for what your goal is ill wait, let you do some real world pricing including getting the work done if your not an engine builder then get back to us......

Well moist of guys who is getting there engines build up here they are build by one of the best motor builder . So if you want , I'll send you his number and go get your build there . Then you will know your engine is build right brothe . And if you know how to wrench , you should be good to take that motor a part and do moist work your self .

 

[SRT10VENOMOUS]

From what I'm gathering is when u put lighter pistons and rods in, your engine will pick up rpm quicker, but you would only see a benefit in the quicker rpm gain with some help like FI or spraying it.

This is a great for NA engines as well, less work for the motor getting threw the rpm faster.

 

[VIPER]

can i get a sho of hands to how many people have "built" a viper engine ? not paid someone to do it but did it them self

how many people have built a viper engine, and just replaced the internals ?

how many people have built a viper engine, stroked out ?

let me see the people that have built these engine speak up !!!

iv built a viper engine, just replaced the stock pistons and rods - and i have a built 540ci viper engine...

can you tell me what the differance is between them ?

a stock vs a stock bore with forged internals

a forged internals vs a bored out engine

tell me what you felt in HP

tell then your talkin out your ass - v8 and other motors are nothing like the viper v-10

 

[VENOMOUS1 RACING]

can i get a sho of hands to how many people have "built" a viper engine ? not paid someone to do it but did it them self

how many people have built a viper engine, and just replaced the internals ?

how many people have built a viper engine, stroked out ?

let me see the people that have built these engine speak up !!!

iv built a viper engine, just replaced the stock pistons and rods - and i have a built 540ci viper engine...

can you tell me what the differance is between them ?

a stock vs a stock bore with forged internals

a forged internals vs a bored out engine

tell me what you felt in HP

tell then your talkin out your ass - v8 and other motors are nothing like the viper v-10

SRT10VENOMOUS your a stright up ****.... IMHO

Again Bud, I have not built a VIPER engine and I know likely you aren't pointing towards me, but I do have to say that all engines are similar in how they work and what they want and what needs to be done to achieve that goal whether NA or FI. I can tell you the difference in everything quoted above except for the math taken to find out exactly how much it was bored and stroked to achieve 540ci but a little research that could be had. I personally DO NOT know how far one can be bored safely, but can do the research by reputable builders who do know. I usually even take in alot of opinions from them all and come to my own conclusion alot of times. ( LIKE YOU CAN'T T56 A QC WITH THE AUTO MOTOR,LOL!!)
This engine does share alot of similarities with a 360 as well as rod length,piston size and so forth.

I only posted to help others understand a little better. Pistons, NOT RODS, CAN ABSOLUTELY GAIN POWER WITH THAT SWAP ONLY!!!

I do have a feeling my next project will be to not only cam and let Greg Good do some head work, but also likely bump compression via a slight milling of the heads as well as a slightly domed piston to get where I want. And I will more than likely use the vast majority of Chevy Speced internals due to price variances and availability.

WE ALL NEED TO REMIND OURSELVES AGAIN THE PURPOSE OF THIS FORUM, AND THAT IS NONE OF US KNOW IT ALL, BUT OFTEN LOOK TO ONE ANOTHER FOR SUPPORT AND IDEAS ON THESE BEASTS. THIS MOTOR STILL HAS ALOT LEFT ON THE PLATE AS FAR AS ADVANCEMENT AND IT WILL NOT HAPPEN WITHOUT FEEDBACK FROM ONE ANOTHER AS ALLIES TO LEARN WHAT WORKS, AND WHAT DOES NOT. WE MUST VENTURE NEW HORIZONS AND PRODUCE BIGGER WORLD RECORDS, TEXAS/FLORIDA MILE CONTENDERS (COMING SOON,LOL) AND ALL OUT STREET STOMPERS. WE NEED THE JOINED EFFORT OF THIS FORUM AND OUR FELLOW VIPER CAR FORUMS TO EXPAND OUR KNOWLEDGE OF THIS AWESOME ENGINE, AND AS STINKER AND MANY OTHER VENDORS HAVE DONE, BRING NEW IDEAS TO THE PLATE THAT WORK!!
I, FOR ONE, AM ONE OF THESE MEMBERS THAT HAS DISSECTED MY TRUCK IN THE NAME OF MAKING A BETTER TRUCK THAN WHAT DODGE DECIDED WAS NEEDED. FROM MAKING A QC A STICK, TO INFUSING A REAR SWAY ON A QC, TO MY OWN DROP KIT, CUSTOM AIR INTAKES, DAYTONA WING ( REGARDLESS OF OTHERS CRITICISM), REMOVING AND POLSHING/PORTING MY INTAKE RUNNERS TO SEE ANY BENEFIT WITH A LOW HP TRUCK, AND PLAN TO KEEP ON PUSHING THE ENVELOPE AS WELL AS MANY OTHERS ON HERE PLAN TO. LET'S KEEP THIS MUTHA ROCKIN' GUYS!:burnout::rock:

 

[yellow446]

If you build 540 . Still it doesn't have to be same as 540 what someone ales is going to do with same power . So I can build this or any other motor my way but it not nesseserly is going to be same as something you would do .

 

[VENOMOUS1 RACING]

If you build 540 . Still it doesn't have to be same as 540 what someone ales is going to do with same power . So I can build this or any other motor my way but it not nesseserly is going to be same as something you would do .

100% correct! Just like you can take the same 505 to the dyno with different mods on each truck and see how they actually put down decent #'s. But, wheelspin and other variables aside, how the truck with less HP can outrun the higher HP (Dyno Queen) truck because of POWERBAND DIFFERENCES and where the TORQUE comes in on both engines. :congrats:

 

[yellow446]

100% correct! Just like you can take the same 505 to the dyno with different mods on each truck and see how they actually put down decent #'s. But, wheelspin and other variables aside, how the truck with less HP can outrun the higher HP (Dyno Queen) truck because of POWERBAND DIFFERENCES and where the TORQUE comes in on both engines. :congrats:

I'm with u on that 100% ... so how is your 6 speed in qc . You think is it any faster now .

 

[SRT10VENOMOUS]

SRT10VENOMOUS your a stright up asshole.... IMHO

awwww thats ok.. I just call em as I see'em .. I dont jump on the i will believe anything anyone tells me anytime... Sorry.. But other than that this thread has some awesome info coming out...

 

[Baddestbugowner]

can i get a sho of hands to how many people have "built" a viper engine ? not paid someone to do it but did it them self

how many people have built a viper engine, and just replaced the internals ?

how many people have built a viper engine, stroked out ?

let me see the people that have built these engine speak up !!!

iv built a viper engine, just replaced the stock pistons and rods - and i have a built 540ci viper engine...

can you tell me what the differance is between them ?

a stock vs a stock bore with forged internals

a forged internals vs a bored out engine

tell me what you felt in HP

tell then your talkin out your ass - v8 and other motors are nothing like the viper v-10

SRT10VENOMOUS your a stright up asshole.... IMHO

I've proudly built two Volkswagen Engines :rock:

 

[VENOMOUS1 RACING]

I'm with u on that 100% ... so how is your 6 speed in qc . You think is it any faster now .

I plan to make a Nice thread about. I love it!! Many on here as well as those more familiar with me know I wanted this from the day I bought her. I finally made a final decision months back and have been collecting parts since. It had to happen by race season for sure. Things went great other than getting shafted on a bad tranny the first go round. I have gained 4-5 MPG, shed about 80lbs(Auto vs. T56) and give or take 50 hp based on previous factory QC vs. RC dyno comparison of parasitic loss of a fluid coupled transmission.
I am extremely happy to ALWAYS be in her powerband when wanted. Not a regret one. I am happy with appearance, transmission, now time for some NA power.



VW guy.........
My first 2 cars were bugz and rebuilt many 1600s into 1700-1800s, Scat shifters (Awesome) twin Delortos, and another pair of Webers for swapping/testing different manifolds carb settle, no less than 6 exhaust sets from Monza( my favs) to stingers, I had Porsche Empi rims in 15x8 with Goodyear Gatorback tires, low profiles. Had Mallory twin point distributor(yuck!!), Porsche whaletail, new (89'Golf I believe) seats. Was a fun little car and did manage much front seat tail in it, lol.

But...... It sucked when all your classmates had T/As, Camaros, Old trucks hopped up 67-72 Chevys out the ass, more mustangs than you could shake a stick at as well as the 67-69 Maros!
It was fast though........ Racing other bugs

 

[Greg Good]

can i get a sho of hands to how many people have "built" a viper engine ? not paid someone to do it but did it them self

let me see the people that have built these engine speak up !!!

Actually, I know of one fellow here that did some of the machine work on his own engine. He did some of the line boring on new the new Program main caps that were installed. Also, he was there every step of the way watching and helping with the engine. I won't mention his name because I'm sure he doesn't want to get involved in this thread. He doesn't do this stuff becaue he chooses not to. He's certainly up to the task though. I'm sure he's not the only one here on the site.

I don't want to step in the middle of a cow patty either, ithis thread is a bit too *lively* for me.

I just wanted to say that there are owners here that do have engine experience.

 

[VIPER]

Actually, I know of one fellow here that did some of the machine work on his own engine. He did some of the line boring on new the new Program main caps that were installed. Also, he was there every step of the way watching and helping with the engine. I won't mention his name because I'm sure he doesn't want to get involved in this thread. He doesn't do this stuff becaue he chooses not to. He's certainly up to the task though. I'm sure he's not the only one here on the site.

I don't want to step in the middle of a cow patty either, ithis thread is a bit too *lively* for me.

I just wanted to say that there are owners here that do have engine experience.

i have no doubt that there are members that have built teh viper motors on there own, i am sorry if some people took my comments the wrong way

 

[VIPER]

awwww thats ok.. I just call em as I see'em .. I dont jump on the i will believe anything anyone tells me anytime... Sorry.. But other than that this thread has some awesome info coming out...

hahaha....... you really are a funny guy, an ******** but a funny guy


so lets lay it out here - so what your tell me :

if i build another engine and replace the OEM pistons and rod's with forged pistons and rods - im going to pick up HP / Preformance "shelf pistons and rods" ????

i think your wrong - there is a TON of other work that will need to be completed to gain performance / HP.....

and to call out a vender ? someone like tony that will go above and beyond the call of duty ? - that should not be allowed !

now if you want to get into a conversation about building a motor

light weight RODs - high compression pistons, custom CAM - heads ect...... well i dont think that wat this thread is about so i will stop there - this thread like many with you turns into a bashing of tony "bc you dont like him" lol

THEN STFU

only way to get HP / Performance gain is to build the engine above OEM spec's

that like saying your can take a stock engine that makes 490 RWHP and tho pistons and rods in it and it will make 600 RWHP

get outta here ! your DEAD WRONG

owell there is no sence in contuining this conversation bc you will twist the words and belive what you want and post wat you want

 

[VIPER]

How much more would better rods and pistons weigh compared to stock ones? Would have to add weight to the crank for balance I would imagine? I would love to do a cam change but going that far apart, might as well forge it! Which gets expensive when considering how much use in this part of the world

remember the Org comment - dont want my words getting twisted like you twisted tonys !

 

[SRT10VENOMOUS]

hahaha....... you really are a funny guy, an ********* but a funny guy


Again I could care less what you or any other ******** thinks on here..

so lets lay it out here - so what your tell me :

if i build another engine and replace the OEM pistons and rod's with forged pistons and rods - im going to pick up HP / Preformance "shelf pistons and rods" ????


Well if you know how to read which you have proven yourself here that you do not know how to read. You would know I said no hp will be gained many times.. Most likely 3 or 4 times in this thread.. But what I did say you can find in my past posts and it goes something like this... Lighter pistons and rods.. Not just any old forged piston or rod.. Will reduce your rotating mass which will allow you to RPM faster and get threw the gears faster, So you do not see results on a dyno but at the track you will see results.. And thats what people are looking for.. Unless like I said before you are building a dyno queen...

Again one quick example for you

You could have a 10000hp engine that revs to 10000hp in 5 minutes.. or a engine wtih 500hp that revs to 500 hp in 5 seconds.. Believe it or not.. On a dyno engine A looks much better than Engine B,, But on the track Engine B will be down the track and half way home before engine A gets to peak hp.... and down the track...


i think your wrong - there is a TON of other work that will need to be completed to gain performance / HP.....

Not arguing with you there ,,, well except that im wrong because I never said that or anything like that.. But hey nice try ..

and to call out a vender ? someone like tony that will go above and beyond the call of duty ? that BS stright up BS - that should not be allowed !

to call out a vendor who pretends hes a pro viper engine builder and have never built one in his life except one that messed up his own motor??? to call out a vendor who makes bogus claims that an aftermarket lighter piston and rod will not improve performance???? are you kidding me.... Would you seriously go and purchase engine work from someone telling you this, and this word is golden.. When he is dead wrong and wont admit it... Ill call out anyone if they are spewing forth pure ****** and pretending to me the big ****** on the forum " wealth of knowledge" when he knows nothing about a viper engine other than how to put on fake carbon fiber..

now if you want to get into a conversation about building a motor

light weight RODs - high compression pistons, custom CAM - heads ect...... well i dont think that wat this thread is about so i will stop there - this thread like many with you turns into a bashing of tony "bc you dont like him" lol

THEN STFU

This thread is not about building motors and talking about how to gain HP or performance or get you down the road faster??/ Thats the topic of this thread >



that like saying your can take a stock engine that makes 490 RWHP and tho pistons and rods in it and it will make 600 RWHP

get outta here ! your DEAD WRONG

owell there is no sence in contuining this conversation bc you will twist the words and belive what you want and post wat you want

again no one said anything like this in this thread except you.. so your dead wrong ... learn how to read... Once again for you.. A lighter piston and rod will not add hp they will allow your engine to lose up to 2kg of rotating mass which will alow your engine to rpm faster,, And that means get your lil piece of glowing plastic on your dash to go from 1krpm to 6krpm faster than it would in a stock application.. Therefore on the track or on a dyno you reach higher HP numbers faster.. So from 0-60mph you would arrive at 60mph faster as your engine was revving faster and therefor your crank was turning faster therefore your drive shaft turning faster therefore your wheels turning faster,, therefore going down the road faster..



Now if you have anything smart to say please do .. But do not go and make up ******* no one said and try to make them look stupid.. Sorry it didnt work out for you this time.. and never willl..

 

[wesalbert]

Just a friendly reminder.......

Watch your language. This is not in the Offensive section, nor will it be moved there.

This goes for everyone.

 

[Yellow venom]

This thread is about building motors and talking about how to gain HP or performance or get you down the road faster is exactly what were looking for in this thread,
were looking for different ways everyone is having engines built to find out what gains they get and what would be the max a NA Viper engine can put out to get these beast a moving faster!:burnout:
Theres been some great info so far,keep it coming.:rock:

 

[yellowfever#154]

Wow this thread is quite interesting.

When did anyone say that lighter pistons and rods were going to make 100hp or 110hp as stated in different replys here?

You guys are missing what venomous is trying to say. Lighter engines rev faster which in turns causes the vehicle to be faster. Sure you wont see it on a dyno but you will on the track.

Why do the pro racers always want the lightest parts? Why does trainman and some others on here remove parts, cut metal from bumpers, etc? Why are people paying shat piles of money for carbon fiber and titanium parts? Because you end up going faster!

Why is everyone fighting about this? Other than the fact that Tony was called out. You all need to let him explain his own statements rather than do it for him.

 

[VENOMOUS1 RACING]

Yup, but again, for the record, YOU CAN JUST CHANGE PISTONS AND MAKE SIGNIFICANT HP GAINS. Not from being Forged and lightweight, but from choosing a different piston crown Design that simply increases Compression Ratio!! Been there done it! WITH NO OTHER MODS PERIOD!!! Pop-Up pistons were the shit back in the days. Add a smaller combustion chamber (305 heads) and BAM!! your 350 is walking big blocks.