WTF

rottenronnie said:
Gen IV Viper engines use (2) drive-by-wire throttle bodies (not compatible with your ECU), different Intake and Exhaust manifold spacing and the Gen IV Heads wont directly bolt onto a Gen III Block.

You CAN get just about anything to work with anything else, with enough time and money.

The Gen III engines have some minor differences. If you find a Gen III from a Quad-Cab (that used 2 Knock-Sensors under the Intake Manifold), that isn’t a deal breaker. The Crank-Position sensor is in a different place on the Quad-Cabs (with an automatic) than it is on a regular cab. That isn’t a deal breaker either.

The simplest/cheapest solution is a Gen III engine from a Regular Cab (high-miler’ or not) you can rebuild properly to last a LONG time.

A block and crank is all you really need but may be harder to source.

My 2 cents.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
IMG_3889.jpeg
 
rottenronnie said:
Gen IV Viper engines use (2) drive-by-wire throttle bodies (not compatible with your ECU), different Intake and Exhaust manifold spacing and the Gen IV Heads wont directly bolt onto a Gen III Block.

You CAN get just about anything to work with anything else, with enough time and money.

The Gen III engines have some minor differences. If you find a Gen III from a Quad-Cab (that used 2 Knock-Sensors under the Intake Manifold), that isn’t a deal breaker. The Crank-Position sensor is in a different place on the Quad-Cabs (with an automatic) than it is on a regular cab. That isn’t a deal breaker either.

The simplest/cheapest solution is a Gen III engine from a Regular Cab (high-miler’ or not) you can rebuild properly to last a LONG time.

A block and crank is all you really need but may be harder to source.

My 2 cents.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
Thanks Ronnie, your input is highly regarded.
The motor in my truck is an 05 they are the only ones with knock sensors and 06. The crank pick up is half way along the block and has notches in the crank. 03 and 04 have flywheel pick ups (timing, crank sensor etc) I will try to get another 05/06 block. Crank appears fine, spins easy. May need a polish.
 
Kiwi SRT10 said:
Thanks Ronnie, your input is highly regarded.
The motor in my truck is an 05 they are the only ones with knock sensors and 06. The crank pick up is half way along the block and has notches in the crank. 03 and 04 have flywheel pick ups (timing, crank sensor etc) I will try to get another 05/06 block. Crank appears fine, spins easy. May need a polish.
Click to expand...
Glad to hear the crank survived. The liners in your block took a beating and the block is now in a better place.

Yes, that is right, (2) spots for the crank pick-up either triggered mid-block or off the flywheel.

The crank can be checked for straightness and (as you say) may only require a polish. While everything is apart I'd still recommend purchasing the Program Main Caps as you will want to check your crank with the "new" block for proper alignment anyway (a.k.a. line or align-boring). You might as well properly align the crank with the block WITH the much better Main Caps installed.

Zero-decking your block lowers octane requirements (sometimes considerably) as the resultant "squish/quench" compresses the mix (making it easier to light-off) AND the "squish" created by the piston running so close to the top of the cylinder, purges the air and cools the far reaches of the combustion chamber "quench", reducing the chances of pre-ignition and/or detonation. There is lots of information available on this topic and is nothing new. It IS important though. What you are after here is machining the block so the flat part of the piston is flush with the top of the block.

If you are using ported O.E.M. heads, WITH zero-decking you can safely run 10.5 or 10.75:1 without using additives at the pump. A target compression ratio of 10.75 will also allow a more aggressive cam profile without penalty.

Supplying your piston manufacturer with pictures of your combustion chamber will help greatly with their design efforts.

If you are lucky enough to find a block close to stock bore sizing, that is best.
0.030" is a maximum overbore size and is otherwise maxed-out when it comes to proper cooling if it has been bored more than this. I.o.w. avoid a block that is 0.030" overbored (or above).

This is the important stuff and adds very little to the overall machine shop (or new piston) costs. You have an opportunity here to make a Viper engine that's: Better, Stronger, Faster!

Cylinder heads are another story...

Again, my 2 cents worth.

Good luck with your project!

Ronnie
 
Last edited:
rottenronnie said:
Glad to hear the crank survived. The liners in your block took a beating and the block is now in a better place.

Yes, that is right, (2) spots for the crank pick-up either triggered mid-block or off the flywheel.

The crank can be checked for straightness and (as you say) may only require a polish. While everything is apart I'd still recommend purchasing the Program Main Caps as you will want to check your crank with the "new" block for proper alignment anyway (a.k.a. line or align-boring). You might as well properly align the crank with the block WITH the much better Main Caps installed.

Zero-decking your block lowers octane requirements (sometimes considerably) as the resultant "squish/quench" compresses the mix (making it easier to light-off) AND the "squish" created by the piston running so close to the top of the cylinder, purges the air and cools the far reaches of the combustion chamber "quench", reducing the chances of pre-ignition and/or detonation. There is lots of information available on this topic and is nothing new. It IS important though. What you are after here is machining the block so the flat part of the piston is flush with the top of the block.

If you are using ported O.E.M. heads, WITH zero-decking you can safely run 10.5 or 10.75:1 without using additives at the pump. A target compression ratio of 10.75 will also allow a more aggressive cam profile without penalty.

Supplying your piston manufacturer with pictures of your combustion chamber will help greatly with their design efforts.

If you are lucky enough to find a block close to stock bore sizing, that is best.
0.030" is a maximum overbore size and is otherwise maxed-out when it comes to proper cooling if it has been bored more than this. I.o.w. avoid a block that is 0.030" overbored (or above).

This is the important stuff and adds very little to the overall machine shop (or new piston) costs. You have an opportunity here to make a Viper engine that's: Better, Stronger, Faster!

Cylinder heads are another story...

Again, my 2 cents worth.

Good luck with your project!

Ronnie
Click to expand...
That’s worth more than 2 cents worth @rottenronnie .. very good info and answered my question about the gen 4 compatibility..
 
And we are still waiting on the Mini me paint job lol
 
Thanks for that.

LOTS more to consider such as final compression ratio, piston-to-wall clearance, ring material, coated piston skirts (yes), coated domes (no), ring end-gap, side-rod clearance (engine builder), crosshatch angle and finish of same (machine shop), to make it all work properly together. (That was a long sentence).
Talk to your piston manufacturer for many answers, as far as numbers go.
It depends how far YOU want to go.

Take your time Kiwi SRT10 and enjoy the ride!
 
Last edited:
rottenronnie said:
Thanks for that.

LOTS more to consider such as final compression ratio, piston-to-wall clearance, ring material, coated piston skirts (yes), coated domes (no), ring end-gap, side-rod clearance (engine builder), crosshatch angle and finish of same (machine shop), to make it all work properly together. (That was a long sentence).
Talk to your piston manufacturer for many answers, as far as numbers go.
It depends how far YOU want to go.

Take your time Kiwi SRT10 and enjoy the ride!
Click to expand...
Your welcome and as always well deserved !
 
Not much available at the moment. Brand new OEM short blocks $30k NZ and then 2-3K shipping.
Some complete engines $8500US to $12KUS $25KNZ does my budget, then still have to strip down and build from scratch. Will watch and wait for something. There is nothing in NZ or Aus. I have the feelers out. There could be something lurking in the back of a shed somewhere.
 
Kiwi SRT10 said:
Not much available at the moment. Brand new OEM short blocks $30k NZ and then 2-3K shipping.
Some complete engines $8500US to $12KUS $25KNZ does my budget, then still have to strip down and build from scratch. Will watch and wait for something. There is nothing in NZ or Aus. I have the feelers out. There could be something lurking in the back of a shed somewhere.
Click to expand...
Drive it to America lol
 
Your photos show considerable damage to the block, but it's hard to see it all.
Strictly from those photos, I've seen even worse brought back to life.
Might be worth getting a repair estimate from your machine shop???
 
This carnage looked brutal, but in the long run its probably worth the engine being out to help us all with what might be in our future. Does anyone know if this is an outcome expected to happen or is there a mileage range to think this might happen at ?
 
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