BecauseRacetruck
Full Access Member
Vipers of the World
Mopar Gen IV hybrid install... underway
- Thread starter WA 2 FST
- Start date
Vipers of the World
From the few stock gen 4 dynos I could find it seems like your about the same as them. I did see some crazy numbers on the gen 4's with bolt ons though
If you made it this far, thanks for reading! You can send your $1 to me anytime.
Where do I send my $1?
Thank you for the honest and thorough review. It will be great to get your driving impressions. A peek at the dyno sheet will be interesting too. Your goal was to have more factory supported power, with stock reliability and drivability. You achieved all that. It sounds like Justin can help you design a cam that will stay within your parameters and add power. Maybe that is worth pursuing?
Will you be contacting Mopar to discuss your results with them?
Porting the lower intake and a camshaft change can get you another 50-70whp without spending a fortune on it (not that you want to spend more money on it), the heads flow great, but without a matching cam they arent even close to hitting their potential. Despite the #'s im sure youll enjoy it when you get it back.
Justin
Justin
VENOMOUS1 RACING
Has Left the Room - Banned from VTCOA!
I totally agree with Justin! A better bumpstick will improve numbers by far.
HERE IS THE PROBLEM!!! One of two things have happened to the Viper Truck engines during assembly and I believe Ronnie has already figured it out but it's his research that discovered it and he keeps it somewhat secret and I can't blame him!
I personally believe the truck engines were either installed with the cam retarded ( by timing chain adjustment) or the camshafts themselves were ground a bit different to help get emission approval where the Viper car didn't need to meet that in certain areas. I believe it had something to do with the gas guzzler taxes on engines of this caliber.:dontknow:
If someone is willing to donate their original camshaft for research I will have them Cam Doctored which will reveal true specs on the camshaft's profile.
:burnout:
canviper
Full Access Member
No matter what WA 2 FST I know you will enjoy your truck when you get it home. And nobody said it would be easy getting big numbers N/A. Thumbs up for trying this package first.:top:. Where do I send my dollar.
No secrets.
The cam was originally installed as per the timing marks BUT the net effect was it ended up being retarded because of an intentional or an accidental install in that position from Dodge. So the cam was GROUND with built-in late timing, ie. the alignment dowel was simply in the wrong place.
It is an OLD trick (and a really cheap one) for allowing a borderline engine to pass emissions by retarding a cam.
As mentioned by Justin as well as on other sites, etc; you won't utilize a performance head with the stock cam. Nor do you need a rank one to make significant gains in power. That could very well be the reason for the funky TQ/HP relationship on your pulls. The Gen IV is a really good head but it needs (as do Strikers) a 1/2 decent cam to be able to properly breathe.
Ronnie
The cam was originally installed as per the timing marks BUT the net effect was it ended up being retarded because of an intentional or an accidental install in that position from Dodge. So the cam was GROUND with built-in late timing, ie. the alignment dowel was simply in the wrong place.
It is an OLD trick (and a really cheap one) for allowing a borderline engine to pass emissions by retarding a cam.
As mentioned by Justin as well as on other sites, etc; you won't utilize a performance head with the stock cam. Nor do you need a rank one to make significant gains in power. That could very well be the reason for the funky TQ/HP relationship on your pulls. The Gen IV is a really good head but it needs (as do Strikers) a 1/2 decent cam to be able to properly breathe.
Ronnie
Last edited:
Something is not right. The gen iv. Head is the best head out there, the have more technology in them than other viper head and when ported and polished and set up will outflow any head out there. You need someone with some experience with the gen 4 head and conversions to get that running right for you.
What does a RC put to the wheels compared to a 04-05 car? I thought it was about the same.
Car is about 25whp higher than a RC truck BUT is spinning a lighter 19" vs a 22" wheel, and has a taller rear gear. Both of those things combined easily make up the 25whp difference on a chassis dyno.
That pretty much kills the idea that the trucks all came with the cams retarded (I know that there was an '06 QC or two that did have this problem though).
It also makes me wonder why we don't all switch to lighter wheels for the street.
Looks and cost, not sure if there is a 22 that is a whole lot lighter.
I say you prove what you have spoken??? My money is on the Strikers!!! Rotten Ronnie already proved that and his mark he has now is a tip of the iceberg to come.
More proof is right around the corner on another set of Strikers!!
Ill get ya some flow numbers, on the heads,,, and the numbers on a couple na builds ...
ill call the shop tomorrow to see if they can get me something..
Sweet! Will be some great info!
Here is the dyno graph.
To make sure everything is disclosed (for the sake of fairness and honesty, not to save anyone's hurt feelings), understand that the baseline run was using a canned tuned ECM. I had my OEM ECM shipped to Mopar and was using this canned tuned one to drive the truck down to ART. Otherwise, I had been running with a Roe-tuned SCT program with my OEM ECM. You may be able to tell from the graph that this canned tune was extremely lean (14.0:1 at WOT), and there was some very mild audible knock. I don't know what it would have made at a safer 13.0:1, but probably down 10hp/10tq or so is my educated guess.
Either way... the package is still short of what was advertised.
Also, you will see that up until ~4200, the stock graph and current setup are almost identical. Looks like a slight loss of TQ from 3500-4000, but that is easily within the error factor of the dyno from run-to-run. From 4200-6000, is where the gains were.
Certainly looks like a matched cam would make a significant difference.
To make sure everything is disclosed (for the sake of fairness and honesty, not to save anyone's hurt feelings), understand that the baseline run was using a canned tuned ECM. I had my OEM ECM shipped to Mopar and was using this canned tuned one to drive the truck down to ART. Otherwise, I had been running with a Roe-tuned SCT program with my OEM ECM. You may be able to tell from the graph that this canned tune was extremely lean (14.0:1 at WOT), and there was some very mild audible knock. I don't know what it would have made at a safer 13.0:1, but probably down 10hp/10tq or so is my educated guess.
Either way... the package is still short of what was advertised.
Also, you will see that up until ~4200, the stock graph and current setup are almost identical. Looks like a slight loss of TQ from 3500-4000, but that is easily within the error factor of the dyno from run-to-run. From 4200-6000, is where the gains were.
Certainly looks like a matched cam would make a significant difference.
That's gotta be a little disappointing no mater how you look at it? 70 HP gain and a loss in torque, I would have way rather had an increase in torque snd a loss in HP!!
Have you had a chance to discuss this build with Mopar??
Have you had a chance to discuss this build with Mopar??
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